<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"> <html> <head> <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> </head> <body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000"> One thing I think we need to consider when talking about all this clipart, is the medium as in use. OCAL uses svg. FreeClipartNow uses jpgs. Two different formats, and I consider ours to be superior. So that may negate their exceptions anyway, since they are different works in themselves, I believe. For instance : <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.freeclipartnow.com/music/instruments/guitars/FlyingVguitar.jpg.html">http://www.freeclipartnow.com/music/instruments/guitars/FlyingVguitar.jpg.html</a> - 2008/03/26 06:34 <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.openclipart.org/detail/280">http://www.openclipart.org/detail/280</a> - 2006-10-02 17:07:34 Now this one was on OCAL first. It's clear. We get to keep it no probs. <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.freeclipartnow.com/music/instruments/guitars/electric-guitar.jpg.html">http://www.freeclipartnow.com/music/instruments/guitars/electric-guitar.jpg.html</a> - 2008/03/26 06:34 <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.openclipart.org/detail/17921">http://www.openclipart.org/detail/17921</a> - 2008-07-18 18:34:08 This one is not so clear. The freeclipart seems to win on the date aspect. However, they only offer Jpg format, and the image is tiny. Whereas the OCAL one is an SVG, not necessarily from the freeclipart site. It may be, it might be not. It's too hard to tell. The jaguar one clearly said that it was derived from that other site. Just some more things to think about. Random checks 2008/03/26 06:34 2008/03/26 06:08 2008/03/26 06:20 I'm starting to suspect that the site is an automated mining site. On 16/06/2010 9:10 p.m., Jarod Russel wrote: <blockquote cite="mid:4C189500.3060600@gmx.de" type="cite"> <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> Fact is that if the majority or at least Jon decides not to allow images that appear on freeclipartnow, there is a lot of cliparts to hide. If you look through there archives you will find quite a few cliparts that are already a long time on OCAL. Just the other day I used a blue bass guitar I found on OCAL for a design and freeclipartnow has the same image in their collection. PD clearly states that there are no rights whatsoever. Meaning also no rights to make restrictions. Otherwise those images are not PD. It is most likely that the owner has no clue and probably has not even made any of the images himself, rather than collecting pd works. Therefore he has no right to make restrictions, why should anybody, whether it is me or OCAL care about those restrictions then? I see things said like "safe PD". There is no such thing. There are no different ways of public domain. Nothing should stop members of OCAL to upload these cliparts if they are true pd, and not like we have seen it here often, uploaded without understanding what pd is. For OCAL the main point should be to figure out whether the clipart is PD or not. Everything else like where it comes from or which sites the clipart can be found on does not matter. Something said on the end. If I seem to be rude or offending to anyone, be assured I do not mean to. I try to make myself clear as good as possible in english, but sometimes its hard to find the right words or ways to say something. So don't take my words to hard on yourself. Am 16-Jun-10 04:03 PM, schrieb chovynz: <blockquote cite="mid:4C187746.7020308@gmail.com" type="cite"> <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> <title></title> Yes we did have this issue, but on different clipart. I was just supporting the conclusion that I read from that thread. I think it does matter that other sites restrict use of their stuff. As I said on some other issues, I really don't care, either way, I just want to be sure I'm taking the right actions. I don't like to make this kind of messy "legal" and "moral" decision, so I'll support the decision we come to. I've been trying to pin Jon down on this issue for awhile now for him to make a decision on it, but he keeps dodging. :-) Ultimately it's "his" site, so a decision from him on this would be nice. Do we ignore their Few Exceptions or do we consider their PD free-game (and us viewed as a "bully".) At the moment I think our policy on "safe" PD stops us from using any clipart from sites that make silly exceptions like this, because once you put any requirements on a PD clipart, it's no longer PD. I would like some clarity on this, and I think ultimatelt only the Site Owners (Jon + ?) can decide. We can try to influence them either way. I'm against taking clipart from sites that make exceptions like these. John Olson is against (as far as I understand.) I think Nicubunu might be against, but I'm not sure. Jarod is for "not caring" about their exceptions. Anyone else want to have their say? Cheers Chovynz On 16/06/2010 6:21 p.m., Jarod Russel wrote: <blockquote cite="mid:4C186D64.1080407@gmx.de" type="cite"> <meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type"> <title></title> Didn't we had this just the other day? If their cliparts are pd than their "Few Exceptions" do not matter, except for the logo and trademark one. Such restrictions are pointless and can be ignored with real pd material. Am 16-Jun-10 02:51 PM, schrieb chovynz: <blockquote cite="mid:4C18664C.7050401@gmail.com" type="cite"> <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8"> Clipart from <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.freeclipartnow.com">http://www.freeclipartnow.com</a> cannot be accepted. Taken from <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.freeclipartnow.com/termsofuse.php">http://www.freeclipartnow.com/termsofuse.php</a> on 16 June 2010, at 5:46pm "Product Usage All graphics on this site are placed into the Public Domain, which means that you can do almost whatever you wish with it. You can put the clipart into your own drawings and documents without any affect on the copyright or license of your work. Few Exceptions. <ul> <li>Company logos and trademarks can be used under "fair use" policy. More info <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Logos">here</a>.</li> <li>You may NOT use any component of our clipart or site content to produce what could be directly or indirectly considered a competitive venture against us.</li> <li>It's not necessary to provide a link back to this site, but it would be greatly appreciated"</li> </ul> Clipart affected. <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.openclipart.org/index.php?pretty=detail/67141">http://www.openclipart.org/index.php?pretty=detail/67141</a> <pre wrap=""><fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset> _______________________________________________ clipart mailing list <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:clipart@lists.freedesktop.org">clipart@lists.freedesktop.org</a> <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/clipart">http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/clipart</a> </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""><fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset> _______________________________________________ clipart mailing list <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:clipart@lists.freedesktop.org">clipart@lists.freedesktop.org</a> <a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/clipart">http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/clipart</a> </pre> </blockquote> </blockquote> <pre wrap=""> <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset> _______________________________________________ clipart mailing list <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:clipart@lists.freedesktop.org">clipart@lists.freedesktop.org</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/clipart">http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/clipart</a> </pre> </blockquote> </body> </html>