Sorry ! I hit the "send" button before finishing my email ! :)<br><br>Please be patient ! I will conclude shortly !<br><br>Louis<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/8/16 Louis Desjardins <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:louis.desjardins@gmail.com">louis.desjardins@gmail.com</a>></span><br> <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">2010/8/16 Camille Bissuel <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:cbissuel@yagraph.org" target="_blank">cbissuel@yagraph.org</a>></span><br> <div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"> to Cyrille Berger :<div><br><br><i>While lgw does not cover the LGA purpose, it matches the lga website. To be<br>honest, from what I have understood, lga = lgw + create.</i><br></div>---> In my view, lga > lgw + create, to another public (users) and other aims (demonstrate + explain +teach ...). LGW is excellent for news and Create is excellent for collaboration between projects, but there are others topics to be covered.<br> Can I mess up the create wiki and change it's aim without starting a flame war ? If I can, I do agree with you that there is no need for another website.</blockquote></div><div><br>Hi Camile !<br><br>Maybe I can suggest you don’t put words like "mess up" in this context ? This is surely paving the way to some sort of mess... :) which is obviously what you don’t want to achieve ! <br> </div><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"><div><br><br><br><i>If people thinks create does not works very well, I fail to see how having an "association" is<br> going to magically solve any problem. Especially, considering that what create<br>lack is mostly of animation.<br>Also, creating an association with no revenue seems to be a lot of<br> bureaucratic work. In many countries, the main point of registering an<br> association is to get access to a bank account.</i><br></div>---> to have a bank account in the future, you have to start by creating an association, not the opposite way. It will allow us to start the project and start to share some means. Furthermore, according to a.l.e, creating an association in Switzerland is really simple and there is no bureaucratic work.</blockquote> </div><div><br>Never underestimate the bureaucratic work... :) <br></div><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"><div> <br> <br><br><i>Finally, I want to encourage any effort in promoting libre creative software,<br>but I add my voices in the "there is already too many separated efforts, lets<br>join force instead of creating new".</i><br> </div> ---> Totally agree with that. What I'm doing wrong to let you think that LGA is not about joining forces ?<br><br>For the Libre graphics magazine, I do agree too, but it will have a far much lesser diffusion than a website. I don't understand why peoples agree on the magazine, and not on the website, despite they share parts on the same objectives (promoting and demonstrating libre graphics tools).<br> Am I stupid ?<br></blockquote></div><div><br>In the eyes of many people on this list we are already into an "association". We belong to this community, we work together, we communicate a lot, we have means to do this. This is what most people would call an association !<br> <br>You have more ideas, which is great ! You think we should embrace more topics that are not covered yet, okay !<br><br>But again, this can all be done going in the same flow we have already. No need to reinvent the wheel. Just push in the same direction. Add some more bits here and there. If we need a more structured association, we have already a discussion on the wiki about this and a few incredibly rich threads on the Creates Mailing List. Already, there is a big work only gathering together those ideas and make them come alive...<br> <br>I think that so far it’s only a matter of communication. I have been participating in the BoF at LGM with you. I am all for a more structured association. We have announced together at LGM that we’d be doing it quickly. The only thing we should do now is do it.<br> <br>Some more notes.<br><br>In 2007 I have put together a non-profit to help organise LGM as I rapidly discovered that in order to get some local sponsorship (especially from the government). Since then, this non-profit has been left there, unused. I haven’t looked after this association for years. I didn’t use it in 2009 because it was too much for me to handle the accounting so I preferred to leave that to the GNOME Foundation. Today, the assocation named "Quebec Association for the Development and Promotion of Free Software" is reviving because we have a big project going on with the Francophonie and we will be handling funds. I have even opened an account in euros so we don’t need to convert the funds and we thus avoid a lot of stress with the handling of international funding, something that is even better than what the GNOME Foundation can offer us, in some way. It would be as easy — and even easier — to open an account in US dollars. But all this have a cost in both money and time. An account at the bank cost a little bit of money. And we have to provide some papers each year to the government, and we need a proper accounting...<br> <br>So there is an association which I run and which has no website ! Nonetheless it works and with this new project with OIF it will be running for months from now. I even have plans to use it next year for LGM — although I am still not sure of that but I am thinking of that...<br> <br>All this to say that if you think we need a better / nicer <br><br></div><div><div></div><div class="h5"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"> <br>I feel that the best way to convince is to start working on it.<br> So, let's go.<br><br>Have a nice day,<br>--yagraph<br><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2010/8/16 a.l.e <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ale.comp_06@xox.ch" target="_blank">ale.comp_06@xox.ch</a>></span><div><div> </div><div><br> <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">hi ginger,<br> <div><div></div><div><br> > > So we could create a magazine (available as PDF, and printed to<br> > > people who want a paper edition, actually someone already started<br> > > such a project, I think<br> > > ?), or a booklet that could be send as "commercial" to companies, a<br> > > book (either tutorial, or a "story" book with illustration created<br> > > with our software).<br> > > All done with free software. Then you can show the results to<br> > > professional, and impress them. When I was a student, I<br> > > participated in editing a student weekly newspaper, we managed to<br> > > print in four colors using a two cylinders rotary printer, the<br> > > seller was so surprised by the result that you could get<br> > > with the machine, that he sent a few samples of our journal to the<br> > > direction<br> > > in Japan. This little story shows that if you do interesting<br> > > things, you will<br> > > get attention.<br> > > There is already an impressive pool of artists using our software,<br> > > lets pull<br> > > them together to create material that display the power of our<br> > > tools.<br> > ><br> ><br> > A great big +1 on the magazine. Just before LGM, Ricardo, Ana, Femke,<br> > a.l.e. and I pulled together Libre Graphics Magazine #0. Since then,<br> > I've been thinking seriously (as I plan workshops and talks for<br> > artists and design students) about the value of doing such a magazine<br> > more frequently. I think it would be a great vehicle around which to<br> > build some user community, as well as a nice, professional public<br> > show of what F/LOSS graphics software can do.<br> ><br> > So I'm game to pick up where we left off on the magazine, and willing<br> > to add some editorial weight to the effort. If anyone else is<br> > interested in working on it too, all the better.<br> <br> </div></div>i'd like to produce a second number while being at <a href="http://froscomp.org" target="_blank">http://froscomp.org</a> .<br> (mid september)<br> <br> the idea is to have the content mostly produced in advanced and having<br> a small crew doing the magazine live at our booth.<br> <br> i'm not sure i will have founds to print it, so it may just be a PDF to<br> put on the web.<br> <br> what do you think about it?<br> <br> could you image to have an active role even if not personally present?<br> (no, i certainly won't have the budget to fly you to zurich! :-)<br> <br> <br> ciao<br> <font color="#888888">a.l.e<br> </font><div><div></div><div>_______________________________________________<br> CREATE mailing list<br> <a href="mailto:CREATE@lists.freedesktop.org" target="_blank">CREATE@lists.freedesktop.org</a><br> <a href="http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/create" target="_blank">http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/create</a><br> </div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><br> <br>_______________________________________________<br> CREATE mailing list<br> <a href="mailto:CREATE@lists.freedesktop.org" target="_blank">CREATE@lists.freedesktop.org</a><br> <a href="http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/create" target="_blank">http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/create</a><br> <br></blockquote></div></div></div><font color="#888888"><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Louis Desjardins<br><a href="http://mardigrafe.com" target="_blank">mardigrafe.com</a><br><a href="http://libregraphicsmeeting.org" target="_blank">libregraphicsmeeting.org</a><br> +1 514 994 9351 (Cell)<br> +1 514 934 1353 ext. 121 (Montréal)<br>HAE / EDT GMT -5<br> </font></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Louis Desjardins<br><a href="http://mardigrafe.com">mardigrafe.com</a><br><a href="http://libregraphicsmeeting.org">libregraphicsmeeting.org</a><br>+1 514 994 9351 (Cell)<br> +1 514 934 1353 ext. 121 (Montréal)<br>HAE / EDT GMT -5<br>