<html><head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=Windows-1252"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div>Marc – I don't understand your argument about Fonts vs. PDF.</div><div><br></div><div>Fonts are licensed in their own way -  with both technical and legal restrictions.  They clearly indicate if the font can be embedded in other formats (not just PDF, but also Word/Office, XPS, etc.) and for what purposes.  In addition, the license usually also restricts conversion of the font into other formats (eg. TTF->WOFF).   All of this has NOTHING to do with PDF.</div><div><br></div><div>As a long time (and "active") member of this project, I am simply raising a concern to protect this project from potential legal action.   I am not suggesting that Adobe is coming after anyone concerning fonts, but as you note below, I do NOT speak for Monotype or any other foundry…</div><div><br></div><div>Leonard</div><div><br></div><span id="OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div style="font-family:Calibri; font-size:11pt; text-align:left; color:black; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt"><span style="font-weight:bold">From: </span> "Marc J. Driftmeyer" <<a href="mailto:mjd@reanimality.com">mjd@reanimality.com</a>><br><span style="font-weight:bold">Reply-To: </span> "Marc J. Driftmeyer" <<a href="mailto:mjd@reanimality.com">mjd@reanimality.com</a>><br><span style="font-weight:bold">Date: </span> Thu, 22 Sep 2011 22:04:20 -0700<br><span style="font-weight:bold">To: </span> "<a href="mailto:poppler@lists.freedesktop.org">poppler@lists.freedesktop.org</a>" <<a href="mailto:poppler@lists.freedesktop.org">poppler@lists.freedesktop.org</a>><br><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject: </span> Re: [poppler] poppler util pdftohtml<br></div><div><br></div><div> <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> Just my two cents from my days at NeXT and Apple:<br> <br> If Adobe were concerned with violating copyright issues with Fonts they never would have released the ISOs for PDF to the general public.<br> <br> You can't have your cake and eat it too.<br> <br> You want PDF to be ubiquitous but then you want to hen peck every Tom, Dick and Harry on licensing third party fonts?<br> <br> Are you authorized to speak for Monotype? Or any other Font Author?<br> <br> Font Portfolios licensed to corporations is a lucrative business. Attempting to police this on an individual who has a document they want to convert to html is asking for a Xerox ruling on Photocopying and your IP becoming so common it becomes worthless.<br> <br> By all means, go after millions of users who extract fonts from PDF documents having embedded fonts in them. Put excessive DRM schemes on your solution.<br> <br> Watch your entire intent of making PDF ubiquitous go down in flames.<br> <br> Adobe better find some other way to leverage their Font technology for profit that is a value added service in n-tier markets or watch your customer base completely erode.<br> <br> This finger waging about Fonts reminds me of that finger waving about Display Postscript and we decided to create Display PDF instead.<br> <br> - Marc<br> <br> On 09/22/2011 03:08 PM, Leonard Rosenthol wrote: <blockquote cite="mid:CAA129BB.C345%25lrosenth@adobe.com" type="cite"> <pre wrap="">I can't recall what you said about this in the past, but since I was just dealing with it today. What do you do about embedded fonts? As my company (Adobe) sells/creates fonts, I want to make sure that pdftohtml won't be violating our IP/licenses. Thanks in advance, Leonard On 9/22/11 5:51 PM, "Josh Richardson" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jric@chegg.com"><jric@chegg.com></a> wrote: </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">On 9/22/11 12:20 PM, "Jonathan Kew" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jfkthame@googlemail.com"><jfkthame@googlemail.com></a> wrote: </pre> <blockquote type="cite"> <pre wrap="">More generally, it is not possible to recreate useful XHTML (or similar) documents from arbitrary PDF files with anything like 100% reliability, because many PDF files do not contain adequate information to accurately map the rendered glyphs back to correct Unicode text, or to reliably reconstruct the proper flow of text. Constructs such as ActualText may help, but are often lacking from real-world PDF documents. </pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap="">W.r.t. rendering glyphs, we get around the problem of missing unicode mappings by taking any glyph without a unicode mapping and assigning it an offset in the private space of Unicode. This produces the correct visual result in the XHTML, but not a full semantic representation. If someone's interested, they could get the semantics right too by pattern-matching the glyph against an appropriate Unicode font. W.r.t. the flow of text, there have been other threads on this topic, but pdftohtml does make some attempt, and I believe it's possible to do this to a high degree of accuracy, maybe >99% -- that said, noone has done ityet, so either it's harder than I think, or no-one has cared enough to really try (and I still fall into that camp.) Best, --josh _______________________________________________ poppler mailing list <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:poppler@lists.freedesktop.org">poppler@lists.freedesktop.org</a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/poppler">http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/poppler</a></pre> </blockquote> <pre wrap="">_______________________________________________ poppler mailing list <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:poppler@lists.freedesktop.org">poppler@lists.freedesktop.org</a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/poppler">http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/poppler</a></pre> </blockquote> <br> <div class="moz-signature">-- <br> Marc J. Driftmeyer<br> Email :: <a href="mailto:mjd@reanimality.com">mjd@reanimality.com</a><br> Web :: <a href="http://www.reanimality.com">http://www.reanimality.com</a><br> Cell :: (509) 435-5212 </div> </div></div></span></body></html>