On 6 Aug 2013 18:32, "Bryan Kadzban" <<a href="mailto:bryan@kadzban.is-a-geek.net">bryan@kadzban.is-a-geek.net</a>> wrote: > > On Tue, Aug 06, 2013 at 11:17:17AM +0200, Tom Gundersen wrote: > > On Tue, Aug 6, 2013 at 11:11 AM, Tom Gundersen <<a href="mailto:teg@jklm.no">teg@jklm.no</a>> wrote: > > > On Tue, Aug 6, 2013 at 10:20 AM, Maarten Lankhorst > > > <<a href="mailto:m.b.lankhorst@gmail.com">m.b.lankhorst@gmail.com</a>> wrote: > > >> Op 05-08-13 18:29, Andy Lutomirski schreef: > > >>> The systemd commit below can delay firmware loading by multiple > > >>> minutes if CONFIG_FW_LOADER_USER_HELPER=y. Unfortunately no one > > >>> noticed that the systemd-udev change would break new kernels as well > > >>> as old kernels. > > >>> > > >>> Since the kernel apparently can't count on reasonable userspace > > >>> support, turn this thing off by default. > > >>> > > >>> commit a3bd8447be4ea2ce230eb8ae0e815c04d85fa15a > > >>> Author: Tom Gundersen <<a href="mailto:teg@jklm.no">teg@jklm.no</a>> > > >>> Date: Mon Mar 18 15:12:18 2013 +0100 > > >>> > > >>> udev: make firmware loading optional and disable by default > > >>> > > >>> Distros that whish to support old kernels should set > > >>> --with-firmware-dirs="/usr/lib/firmware/updates:/usr/lib/firmware" > > >>> to retain the old behaviour. > > >>> > > >> methinks this patch should be reverted then, > > > > > > Well, all the code is still there, so it can be enabled if anyone wants it. > > > > > >> or a stub should be added to udev to always fail firmware loading so timeouts don't occur. > > > > > > I think the only use (if any) of a userspace firmware loader would be > > > for anyone who wants a custom one (i.e., not udev), so we shouldn't > > > just fail the loading from udev unconditionally. > > > > > > How about we just improve the udev documentation a bit, similar to > > > Andy's kernel patch? > > > > Sorry, I should first have checked. We already document this in the README: > > > > > Userspace firmware loading is deprecated, will go away, and > > > sometimes causes problems: > > > CONFIG_FW_LOADER_USER_HELPER=n > > ...And this patch is making the kernel default to the correct behavior, > instead of the now-broken-by-udev behavior. > > I'm not sure I see the issue with it? :-) Oh yeah this patch is totally the right thing to do, I was just arguing that there is nothing to be done on the udev side. > (Add me to the list of people that think udev is broken too, fwiw. But > let's at least not leave *both* sides in a broken-by-default state.) Well I don't think it is too much to ask that the kernel and udev should be configured in a consistent way. Especially as thing still work even if you get it wrong, albeit with a delay. Cheers, Tom