<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><br><div><div>On May 7, 2011, at 12:18 AM, Russell Shaw wrote:</div><blockquote type="cite"><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font>"not use overlapping windows" ?<br><br>Many applications use a bunch of top-level windows instead of MDI windows<br>within windows. That's a limitation of the widget toolkits. It can be done<br>ok with Xlib. If "internal" windows need maximize/minimize buttons on a<br>title bar, the application or widget toolkit will need to draw and manage<br>them itself.</div></blockquote><br></div><div>I am not talking about MDI.</div><div><br></div><div>On both X and Windows, it is impossible for an application to make windows A, B, and T (where T is a "toolbox" for instance) where T remains atop A *and* B at all times, while also T acts like a regular window in that other applications can appear atop it.</div><div><br></div><div>"Solutions" have typically been to make "layers" where T remains atop everything. X also tried "window groups" which is what Gimp tried and tried to use, but had problems in that window managers never implemented them, partly because no programs used them but also because of stupidly complex design. If Gimp could completely control the front-to-back order of it's windows, the api it wants would be so trivial it is hard to believe. </div><div><br></div><div><div>Gimp has tried to do this for years and has finally given up. Commercial software, especially stuff for Windows, gave up long ago. Everybody has reverted to a single window where all the toolboxes are "tiles" inside it. This is simply the result of the fact that they cannot control the window stacking, but thousands have been brainwashed into thinking that this method of avoiding system bugs is some kind of "feature".</div><div><br></div></div><div>Layers are a very annoying and a security problem, and it is odd that some here are trying to claim these security problems caused by server-side window management will actually be a problem with client-side (in fact both will have problems but client-side is so much much simpler that I think it is easier to solve that way). I NEVER said Gimp could keep it's windows on top under client-side window management. It just can enforce T above both A and B, it cannot force T above windows it does not own.</div><div><br></div></body></html>