GitHub considered harmful

[Ryan Gonzalez]

One thing that may be worth adding on to this: Silverblue's tracker and
docs to GitHub, and that's also where a lot of Project Atomic / SB-related
projects are hosted (bubblewrap, rpm-ostree).

On Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 3:58 AM Alexander Larsson <alexl at redhat.com> wrote:

> On Thu, Oct 10, 2019 at 11:26 AM Michael Gratton <mike at vee.net> wrote:
> > On Thu, 10 Oct, 2019 at 10:53, Alexander Larsson <alexl at redhat.com>
> > wrote:
> > >
> >
> > > Now, to the issue at hand. As I said, I disagree with (some of) ICE
> > > current policies, however, I don't believe us immediately dropping
> > > github is an efficient way of causing these policies to change.
> >
> > Well, I guess that's where I disagree. There's only going to be one way
> > to convince them to drop what is otherwise an easy $200k, which is
> > start costing them money because of it.
>
> Its already costing them money. They did a $500k donation to "offset"
> the $200k causing it to be a net loss deal, and thats not even
> considering all the bad PR they are already getting over this from
> various sources.
>
> > You see how effective this is when (say) bigoted news readers say
> > something particularly heinous, such that people start contacting their
> > advertisers and getting them to cancel ad their ad spend the show -
> > there's always a quick reversal.
>
> Well, cancelling ads is very easy to do, and easy to reverse. A large
> infrastructure reboot is not that easy, so it has to be considered
> much more carefully.
>
> And there is also the question of what guarantees that the new host is
> any better (see the link to gitllab policy in my other mail). In fact,
> am I any better? I'm currently employed by the company that literally
> tabulated the holocaust...
>
> My personal opinion about this is:
>
> I find what ICE is doing reprehensible, and I would prefer if github
> dropped ICE as a customer. But I realize the complexities of business,
> and this contract is imho not something fundamental or defining of the
> github organization either in terms of money or in moral values, nor
> is it (I assume) a major thing for the ICE operational capabilities. I
> also think that flatpak moving elsewhere will not really add a
> significant effect to this particular case as this is already being
> fought in a lot of ways.
>
> So, currently I don't think there is an urgent need to switch from
> github to something else.
>
> However, long-term we should maybe look at options for infrastructure
> that are not directly tied to any particular company. For example,
> freedesktop.org is pretty closely tied with flatpak in terms of values
> and goals.
>
> Of course, other developers may have different opinions.
>
> --
> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>  Alexander Larsson                                Red Hat, Inc
>        alexl at redhat.com         alexander.larsson at gmail.com
>
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