[HarfBuzz] HB-NG and Qt

[Konstantin Ritt]

 2014-11-06 21:32 GMT+04:00 Behdad Esfahbod <behdad at behdad.org>:
>
> On 14-11-05 11:50 PM, Khaled Hosny wrote:
> > Tahoma (at least the version shipped in Windows 7) has a kern table,
> > but no kern feature in its GPOS table, so HarfBuzz will not apply the
> > kern table as Behdad described. Uniscribe does not apply the kern
> > table here either AFAICT, so I think the font is working as intended.
>
> That was indeed my thinking before. From what I remember, Uniscribe *never*
> applied the TrueType 'kern' table; it was left to applications to do that.
>
> So I think what I like to see is: on versions of Windows that ship with
> such
> fonts, does notepad apply kerning? If it does, we should do in HarfBuzz.
> Otherwise I'm leaning towards keeping HarfBuzz as is.
>
 Notepad on my Win7 doesn't apply kerning for Tahoma.


> That said, "fixing" this is about three lines of code. If Konstantin wants
> it
> badly, I don't mind doing it.
>
That wasn't me who wants, that was a user who thinks it is a noricable
regression since when we were using HB-old :)

As a possible solution, can we have some flag to switch between "agressive"
(forced) and a feature-driven kerning?

2014-11-04 10:51 GMT+04:00 Behdad Esfahbod <behdad at behdad.org>:

> The rule in HarfBuzz-ng is, if the font has *any* GPOS, then the old-style
> kern table is not applied. This is not exactly what OpenType recommends,
> but
> is a cleaner approach than applying old-style kern if the GPOS table has no
> 'kern' feature.
>
What OpenType recommends for such fonts?


Regards,
Konstantin

2014-11-07 0:25 GMT+04:00 Jonathan Kew <jfkthame at gmail.com>:

> On 6/11/14 20:10, Khaled Hosny wrote:
>
>> On Thu, Nov 06, 2014 at 09:32:26AM -0800, Behdad Esfahbod wrote:
>>
>>> On 14-11-05 11:50 PM, Khaled Hosny wrote:
>>>
>>>> Tahoma (at least the version shipped in Windows 7) has a kern table,
>>>> but no kern feature in its GPOS table, so HarfBuzz will not apply the
>>>> kern table as Behdad described. Uniscribe does not apply the kern
>>>> table here either AFAICT, so I think the font is working as intended.
>>>>
>>>
>>> That was indeed my thinking before.  From what I remember, Uniscribe
>>> *never*
>>> applied the TrueType 'kern' table; it was left to applications to do
>>> that.
>>>
>>> So I think what I like to see is: on versions of Windows that ship with
>>> such
>>> fonts, does notepad apply kerning?  If it does, we should do in HarfBuzz.
>>> Otherwise I'm leaning towards keeping HarfBuzz as is.
>>>
>>
>> I tried notepad while testing this and it did not apply kerning for that
>> font (I got kerning in few other random fonts I tried, just in case).
>>
>
> In the fonts where you did get kerning, is there a GPOS 'kern' feature
> present?
>
>
>>  That said, "fixing" this is about three lines of code.  If Konstantin
>>> wants it
>>> badly, I don't mind doing it.
>>>
>>> Jonathan, what do you think?
>>>
>>
>> I recall people complaining loudly when Firefox started using HarfBuzz
>> for Latin in Windows because it applied kerning to some fonts that other
>> Windows applications did not kern (not sure what fonts/Windows versions
>> were involved, though).
>>
>
> Right. There appear to be some fonts out there that have overly
> "aggressive" kern tables, but as Windows apps in general don't apply the
> kerning, nobody notices. Then when someone does start applying the kerning,
> people don't like the result.
>
> JK
>
>
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