[LGM] finances
Louis Desjardins
louis.desjardins at gmail.com
Fri Nov 24 17:16:24 UTC 2017
2017-11-24 11:51 GMT-05:00 Dave Crossland <dave at lab6.com>:
> Hi
>
> Who at GNOME Foundation can provide details of their interest in this and
> their overhead charges (if any)?
>
I just wrote to GNOME to explore that path. I am currently waiting for an
answer. As soon as I get it, I will get back here.
>
> On Nov 24, 2017 12:00 AM, "Soenke Zehle" <soenke at kein.org> wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > the Saarbruecken network that submitted a proposal for 2019 includes a
> non-profit company in charge of the art academy's think tank, transfer and
> training activities. It is financed through overhead charges (which cover
> the cost of handling invoices etc) , but in principle this is an option if
> K8 were already to act as cooperating partner in 2018. Just an idea if
> GNOME falls through.
>
> Thank you Soenke, this seems like a good Plan B to me. If we go that way,
> I wonder that the sponsorship agreement could potentially cover 2018 and
> 2019 LGMs to simplify things and have some continuity.
>
Yes, agree too that it’s a good plan B.
Let’s keep in mind that both the GNOME or the Saarbruecken network would
only act as SFH (Secure Funds Holder) until everything is settled with SPI
who will in turn take care of the reimbursement process after LGM.
LGM Seville is 26-30 April 2018.
Today is Nov. 24. That’s 5 months ahead of LGM. I believe the SPI way can
be settled within those 5 months.
Louis
>
> Do you know what the overhead charges are structured as, exactly? :)
>
> I'm guessing there are 2 sets of charges possible
>
> - one for receiving the funds, holding them securely, and sending out a
> series of transfers clearly communicated by the person from LGM taking
> responsibility for the travel bursaries administration;
>
> - one for doing that work, if such a person doesn't volunteer or isn't
> assigned this responsibility by the LGM organization
>
> On Nov 24, 2017 6:42 AM, "ale" <a at 414c45.net> wrote:
>
> Hi Dave!
> We've bank accounts of course but I think the main issue then is the
> administration of this money
>
>
> I agree!
>
> I think we need to schedule a quick vote or two, to (a) formally set out
> there process of offering and administering a travel bursary and (b)
> solicit volunteers and/or nominees, and pick one.
>
> This administration would invite handling all of the pre-payment work:
> committing a final list of recipients, amounts, and payment addresses.
>
> Having worked with Frank Trampe as a fontforge contract developer I think
> he would be effective in this and hereby nominate him :)
>
>
> (and the taxes of receving such a payment:
> we'd need to look for a 'formula' for handling this because these
> accounts are not related to a non-profit activity).
>
>
> As I said, I believe if the payments in and out are within the accounting
> year of a taxable organization, the organization won't be liable for
> taxation. I am not an accountant and this is not accounting advice, but I'm
> eager to hear from anyone who thinks I'm wrong on this point :)
>
>
> I always thought this is not a task of the local group but of a specific
> comission of the 'international network'. Am I wrong with this? I fear
> that it could become too much work if we add to the organisational tasks
> to keep track of the money and the reimbursements.
>
>
> I agree that this should not fall on the shoulders of the local team
> unless they are eager to do it.
>
> If there is no volunteer that the central committee holds responsible for
> administering travel bursaries, it seems to me inevitable that the
> organization will have to use some of the funds to pay for a contractor to
> be responsible.
>
> I have no problem with that, although I recognize that such contracting
> can be corrosive to volunteer led efforts.
>
> Cheers
> Dave
>
>
>
>
> Best,
> Ale.
>
>
> El 24/11/17 a las 00:49, Dave Crossland escribió:
> > Hi
> >
> > Would the local venue host be able to accept such a payment, and have
> > someone to administer the expense claims?
> >
> > On Nov 23, 2017 5:47 PM, "Dave Crossland" <dave at lab6.com
> > <mailto:dave at lab6.com>> wrote:
> >
> > Hi
> >
> > Thanks Louis :)
> >
> > To be clear I'm not making that offer right now, but saying I'm
> > willing to work within Google to advocate for it. However before I
> > do that, I want to be sure that there is a recipient organization
> > ready to go if I can succeed :)
> >
> > On Nov 23, 2017 2:30 PM, "Louis Desjardins"
> > <louis.desjardins at gmail.com <mailto:louis.desjardins at gmail.com>>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > 2017-11-23 16:05 GMT-05:00 Dave Crossland <dave at lab6.com
> > <mailto:dave at lab6.com>>:
> >
> >
> > Hi
> >
> > Google is a big company, but Google Fonts is not a big team,
> > and it would be just me handling this, and I don't have time
> > to administer individual reimbursements. What I do have time
> > for is a single sponsorship agreement (using a Google
> > template contract) and cutting a single check to an LGM
> > entity, be that an umbrella one or a direct one.
> >
> > Am I right that if Google Fonts was to offer to sponsor LGM
> > with a single $15,000 payment in December (ie, get the
> > agreement signed before end of this month, next week, then
> > invoice within first two weeks of December) then this
> > wouldn't be possible because LGM has no legal entity that
> > could sign a sponsorship agreement and invoice the money?
> >
> > If so, that's a pity, because it may be easier for me to
> > offer than now then next year, due to the nature of 'end of
> > year' liquidity.
> >
> >
> > This is a fan-tas-tic opportunity we ab-so-lu-te-ly cannot let
> go!
> >
> > I strongly urge the LGM organisers to enforce the decision that
> > was made years ago when we thoroughly discussed about the
> > finances as to go for SPI without delay.
> >
> > If we feel we need a vote, then let’s organise one.
> >
> > More infos are posted here:
> > https://www.spi-inc.org/projects/associated-project-howto/
> > <https://www.spi-inc.org/projects/associated-project-howto/>
> >
> > It takes a couple months (there is a 60-day delay once the Board
> > has accepted), so we’re not ahead of time. The Board of SPI has
> > to meet (monthly) and analyse the project before they submit it.
> >
> > If this is too long and puts the Google Font subsidy at risk,
> > then the only other viable solution I can think of, is to ask
> > the GNOME Foundation to make the Google transaction for LGM and
> > then transfert that money to SPI once we’re accepted officially.
> > They will be both US 501(c)3 Non-Profit Organizations and so can
> > send money to one another with not fiscal impact (at least, this
> > is what I understand and it would be advisable to check this
> > first with both SPI and GNOME). Whether GNOME would still take a
> > % off the grant remains to be discussed. We should be able to
> > negociate a no-fee transaction for such a particular case.
> >
> > If someone has a better idea, please step in quick. This is an
> > urgent matter.
> >
> > Thanks Dave!
> >
> > Louis
> >
> >
> >
> > Cheers
> > Dave
> >
> > On 22 November 2017 at 19:05, Louis Desjardins
> > <louis.desjardins at gmail.com
> > <mailto:louis.desjardins at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > Hi folks,
> >
> > After reading tonight’s log, here my 2-cents.
> >
> > I strongly support that we connect with SPI.
> > https://www.spi-inc.org/projects/services/
> > <https://www.spi-inc.org/projects/services/>
> > and let them handle the money and the reimbursements.
> >
> > /The tax-deductible thing is really only noise in the
> > discussion. Each country handles its fiscal law
> > regardless of others. There is no practical solution to
> > this problem. If we go the SPI way, money donated by
> > individuals from within the USA will be tax-deducted,
> > other money won’t. However, a regular compagny that
> > would provide a subsidy to LGM from anywhere in the
> > world will probably enter it into its expenses and thus
> > will reduce by the same its bottom line... and hence
> > will pay less income tax. Again, not an issue. (Also,
> > considering the average amount we got from individuals
> > (in Pledgie), this was less than $50 so tax-deductible
> > would only be a fraction of small amounts. Nothing worth
> > establishing a global multinational organisation to save
> > little money. Let’s not get hysterical!)/
> >
> > I suggest we vote on this to give some weight to the
> > decision. If the majority votes for SPI, we’re in; money
> > can go there.
> >
> > What’s left to us is to find sponsors. SPI won’t help
> > us. But they can handle the money, in and out.
> >
> > If we’d prefer, we could vote on the reimbursements and
> > ask if we want to pursue, or not.
> >
> > In any way, we need to clarify things quick.
> >
> > We also need to think long-term.
> >
> > Cheers!
> >
> > Louis
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > 2017-11-19 6:36 GMT-05:00 Louis Desjardins
> > <louis.desjardins at gmail.com
> > <mailto:louis.desjardins at gmail.com>>:
> >
> > 2017-11-18 16:13 GMT-05:00 Dave Crossland
> > <dave at lab6.com <mailto:dave at lab6.com>>:
> >
> > Hi
> >
> > I think Google Fonts may be interested in this
> > sponsorship, with a focus on bringing people
> > together to do focused work on Variable Font
> > support in all libre graphics applications.
> >
> > Felipe Sanches was working on Inkscape support
> > and got stuck, so if he can attend and meet
> > Inkscape core devs to make progress towards
> > being ready to ship, that would be great.
> >
> > What were the total budgets for lgms in the past?
> >
> >
> > Roughly :
> > - Europe LGMs : 10-15K USD
> > - North America LGMs - 20-30K USD
> > - Outside “Occidental North” is much higher (from
> > rough evaluations).
> >
> > The numbers greatly vary from the needs of
> > travellers and we have no way of accurately
> > predicting this until late in the process of
> > organising a LGM (ie, after we know who’s coming
> > from which team, who makes a talk, who animates a
> > workshop, who’s in need of travel sponsoring).
> >
> > If you can have money from Google (say, they reserve
> > an envelope of 15K for Sevilla), the best way to
> > handle it would be through them directly (Google
> > money to sponsored participant directly), using
> > their administrative way, forms, money handling, etc.
> >
> > If this is not feasible but Google accepts to
> > sponsor the event, then we need an organisation to
> > handle this.
> >
> > From experience, the reimbursement process is not
> > easy because of the many variables that are unknown
> > at some point in the reimbursement process,
> > including bad bank infos, missing documents,
> > impossibility to handle a reimbursement based on
> > where in the world the transaction ends (some money
> > get stuck months in intermediary banks). Probably
> > things that a company such as Google would handle
> best.
> >
> > *
> >
> > To those who have been participating in the past
> > discussions on that subject:
> >
> > 1. I am permanently out of this process now, given
> > a) the level of dissatisfaction and b) the level
> > of non-enthusiasm the detailed proposals I’ve
> > made to solve the issue in a sustainable manner
> > have received.
> > 2. We definitely had a final decision of moving to
> > a international non-profit organisation who
> > already handles the money of many FLOSS
> > projects, for a decent fee. Side note: I am
> > *very surprised* to see that in the past 3
> > years, and after the heavy discussions we had
> > about finances, nothing has moved forward
> > (although the decision was made). Lots of talks,
> > no action.
> >
> > It’s never to late for action. Either give up on
> > reimbursements or make it happen.
> >
> > To me, if Dave can have Google be on our side again
> > and handle the reimbursements, I support this
> > strongly. I think it’s the most simple way and it
> > will take away from us the most difficult task in
> > the organisation of LGM.
> >
> > As a long time LGM supporter and organiser, I am
> > still ready to help, with other stuff.
> >
> > Have a wonderful day!
> >
> > Louis
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Nov 18, 2017 10:38 AM, "Gregory Pittman"
> > <gpittman at iglou.com <mailto:gpittman at iglou.com>>
> > wrote:
> >
> > On 11/18/2017 10:01 AM, ale rimoldi wrote:
> > > hi
> > >
> > > so, if i understand it correctly, the
> > current status is that we will
> > > not have any "official" reimbursement of
> > travel costs from the global
> > > lgm for 2018.
> > >
> > > if anybody is not comfortable with this,
> > please step up before the next
> > > lgm meeting and let us discuss it!
> > >
> > > (for reference: it has also been suggested
> > that we should get (and
> > > help...) the teams to collect their own
> > money).
> > >
> >
> > I think another way to look at this is to
> > try to see it from the
> > outside. Why would or should some outside
> > organization donate to this
> > meeting? What's in it for them? We know it
> > doesn't have to be some
> > monetary return for some corporation, but
> > still, of the various meetings
> > and organizations that are out there, why
> > donate to LGM?
> >
> > We have to try to begin to answer this
> question.
> >
> > Having said this, I have put out a feeler to
> > Red Hat, and so far the
> > response has been rather feeble.
> >
> > Greg
> >
> > _____________________________
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> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Cheers
> > Dave
> >
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> --
> ale [414c45.net · wwb.cc · @414c45]
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