[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 102915] Restore Clear Direct Formatting (an uno: ResetAttributes command) to the context menu

[bugzilla-daemon at bugs.documentfoundation.org]

https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=102915

--- Comment #25 from Cor Nouws <cno at nouenoff.nl> ---
Hi all,

Sorry for the long read.
Thanks for reopening Stuart and Jay and Stuart for showing links for
discussion.

Reasons I see for restoring the item:

 = = = =
(In reply to V Stuart Foote from comment #4)
> See discussions for removal in ...

First: all (maybe all but one) of the mentioned links do _not_ discuss at all
why 'Clear Direct Formatting'  should be removed or not.

(In reply to V Stuart Foote from comment #4)
> See discussions for removal in UX Design minutes and in

I've checked ~40 minutes from 2014/2015 and there was no mention of any
discussion or whether or not to remove 'Clead Direct Formatting'.
Of course I may have missed it, in which case I would appreciate to learn the
arguments.

> bug 81132
> https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/11111
> https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/13214
> 
> and finalized
> bug 86606
> https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/14979

 = = = =
Second: also other linked issues (here or in 102915) do not have any
argumentation on the subject.

 = = = =

Third, In reply to Yousuf Philips (jay) from
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=102915#22)

> (In reply to Cor Nouws from comment #7)
> > Few things that I notice:
> > 1. Dialogs Character, Paragraph and Bullets and Numbering are also direct
> > formatting tools. And present in the context menu.
> 
> They are present as they arent in the toolbars and are only available in the
> menus.

The argument was that all direct formatting items were removed.

> > 2. Clear Direct Formatting is to be considered a styles tool.
> 
> Its a direct formatting tool as it doesnt affect styles.

It is a powerful tool to work with styles properly.
I'm really sorry that I have to type such an obvious argument down.

> (In reply to Cor Nouws from comment #12)
> > Clear Direct Formatting is maybe not that often used, but at least as
> > important.
> 
> Definitely important enough that it was added to the toolbars.

A toolbar is not a context menu.
The context menu can be started without moving the mouse, and even without
using the mouse (properties key or extra in LibreOffice Shift+F10)
Further more: as people access the context menu often, there is a good change
they will discover the item in the neatly trimmed context menu (compared to the
richly filled tool bar), thus enhancing the use of tools for working with clear
(... ;) ) styles.

> (In reply to V Stuart Foote from comment #14)
> > Did Maxim overshoot during conversion of the context menus for
> > customization? Should a "Clear Direct Formatting" be included by default on
> > the context menu?
> 
> So I was removing it in 5.1/5.2 in this patch (
> https://gerrit.libreoffice.org/#/c/20446/ ) and Maxim suggested i not push
> it in as it would conflict with his work and he would incorporate my changes
> into his patch.

You kindly asked him to do so in your comment from December 15 2015.
I see no trace however of deliberate choice to remove the function.

> (In reply to tagezi from comment #11)
> > I'm sorry, but that you have indicated there is no new information. Removing
> > the item is not only logical, but also harmful. And the fact that the design
> > team did not see such a simple thing very frustrating. I feel that with this
> > approach, the design team will create us something like MSO - absolutely not
> > usability thing.
> 
> The discussion regarding the removal of direct formatting entries is in bug
> 81132 and i removed the entry from the context menu once it was added into
> the formatting toolbar. With easy access to the option in the toolbar, it
> shouldnt be available in the context menu.

As written before: 
- there is no separate discussion on removing the choice 'Clead Direct
Formatting'.
- access to the toolbar cannot be considered equal to access to the context
menu.

 = = = =

Fourth: https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=102915#c19
76% of 125 votes say yes to the question "Do you need the function "Clear
Direct Formatting" in Writer's context menu?"

-- 
You are receiving this mail because:
You are on the CC list for the bug.