[tdf-discuss] Re: Remove ActiveX from LibreOffice

timofonic timofonic timofonic at gmail.com
Tue Jan 12 07:36:39 PST 2016


I'm an humble and unskilled user, but here's my opinion:

- I personally think technologies like ActiveX are a double sword, they
help others to get attached to the Microsoft ecosystem. This technology
isn't an open standard and has potential security risks.
- I see this issue is taken serious with ActiveX, but there's another
dangerous technology: Java.
* Do you remember what happened with Oracle vs Java? They are switching to
OpenJDK, but personally I think that environment is poisoned by a
corporation as greedy and corrupt like microsoft.
* I think Java is a security risk, not so multiplatform in reality and not
so efficient. It should be avoided and eliminated from LO codebase.

What about making Python and Lua more important in LibreOffice?

- Lua:
* It's extremely lightweight and it did born for configure files.
* It can be used to replace certain native code that is difficult to
maintain or prone to lots of changes.
* You can use a JIT or compile it as native code, there are different
* It could make LibreOffice more customizable: Do you think LibreOffice UI
is awful? Are you a keyboard junkie that is used to console text editors?
Do you have some disability that requires a specific interface (visual,
tactile, eye movement, voice...) No problem if the UI could be easy to
adapt to make it work in different ways.

- Python
* There's UNO: Who uses it?
* What about using the more faster Python implementations?

I think LibreOffice needs to have a more disruptive and innovative approach:

- I always considered emacs something very interesting, but not practical.
* elisp and lack of multithreading make it very unusable.
* It's unusable until you master it. It's good you can do some magic with
programming skills and get used to keyboard use, but there should be a
friendly start and the default mode should be easy for unskilled computer
* Despite of that, the Emacs community is impressive: There's constant
loads of new extensions for it, very enthusiast users t the level some of
them are unfortunately zealots.

- I'm jealous of Atom, despite being "just" a text editor:
* It has loads of extensions.
* It could be used as an IDE for programing, web development and design.
* But I consider the "web native" apps really resource eaters.

What's the future of LibreOffice? Does it want to be just a Microsoft
Office clone?
- Why not make it a more flexible but lightweight at same time?
- What about niches? Engineering, sciences, education, programming.
- What about making it not freeze while saving and all these annoying stuff?

I would love:

- Writer: The best of a "text processor". Become a powerful ide. Able to
edit using markup languages. Able to use DVCS like Git.
- Calc: Make it more advanced
* Stadistic features of the old SMPS one or even better.
*  Integrate CAS (Computer Algebra System) in some reliable and flexible
approach: Maxima, SageMath integration, resurrect CmathOOoCAS (it uses
Xcas/Giac), CoCoA.
- Make Math a real scientific tool.
* What about merging it with some CAS tool?
* What about provide RPN?
* What about making it able to be used as an advanced scientific calculator
and even interoperability with commercial ones?
* It needs some love in the boolean logic features, too.

- All: What about RTCE? Interoperability with e-learning systems like
Moodle? Able to be used to embed scientific/technical information like CAD,
EDA, 3D?

I know my ideas are insane, but that's what my insane mind think about the
ideal LO :)

Kind regards.

LibreOffice only goes to get the low hanging fruit. It may seem a good
approach, but makes it a curse.

On Tue, Jan 12, 2016 at 2:03 PM, Rick C. Hodgin <rick.c.hodgin at gmail.com>

> If you search for "Microsoft Excel Automation" you'll find many references
> online of how ActiveX is used in other applications to allow the Excel
> engine to compute things in a spreadsheet form.  Were the same ability
> well-documented in LibreOffice, many people would switch as LibreOffice is
> free, and Excel costs hundreds of dollars.
> I urge you not to remove it, but to improve it for simpler integration.  It
> should work like this:
> lo = CreateObject("libreoffice.application")
> lo.open("c:\path\to\my\document\file.ext")
> lo.visible = .t.
> And in that way, an application can directly integrate operations into
> their app which loads LibreOffice.  Note that these examples are in Visual
> Basic, but the same general form works from any application, including C++
> (see below):
> Here are some automation examples for Excel, Word, Outlook, and PowerPoint:
> Excel:  https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/219151
> Word:  https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/316383
> Outlook:  https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/220595
> A more example-by-example based tutorial:
> PowerPoint:
> https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb871574%28v=vs.80%29.aspx
> Here's a code snippet on how to access ActiveX from another application
> using C++ from MSDN:
> https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/196776
> ActiveX allows applications to integrate each other, and to have windowed
> portions within an application which are actually a "portal" through to the
> other application, though it appears to be fully integrated.  It is a
> powerful tool.  And as I say, I have not used LibreOffice for integration
> because I could not find good documentation on how to do it, whereas there
> are many online resources on how to use Microsoft Office integration.  If
> the documentation were better, Windows people would use it as it is highly
> desirable.
> Best regards,
> Rick C. Hodgin
> On Mon, Jan 11, 2016 at 9:52 AM, James E Lang <jim+lod at lang.hm> wrote:
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Bryan Quigley <gquigs at gmail.com>
> > To: libreoffice <libreoffice at lists.freedesktop.org>
> > Sent: Sun, 10 Jan 2016 15:41
> > Subject: Re: Remove ActiveX from LibreOffice
> >
> > ---------->8=====
> >
> > >My position on ActiveX is to leave it (lest we break applications in the
> > wild,) and to *announce its deprecation* with two goals: first, solicit
> the
> > feedback of LO ActiveX consumers and, if so inclined to continue using
> it,
> > help in its support. And second, to flag a date in the future when
> ActiveX
> > will be completely removed from LO codebase, pending sufficient reason
> and
> > support by its consumers.
> >
> > [Just to toss in a comment from a NOT NECESSARILY typical USER, I would
> > probably fail to see any depreciation notice unless it were thrown in my
> > face each time I used the feature until I say (in effect), "all right,
> > Enough Already, SHUT UP!" aka, "Don't show this notice again." The same
> > should apply to revising any existing menu accelerators. --jl]
> >
> > ---------->8=====
> >
> > --
> > Jim
> > _______________________________________________
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> > LibreOffice at lists.freedesktop.org
> > http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice
> >
> >
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