[Tango-artists] CC-SA & GPL Compatibility

[Andreas Nilsson]

Michael Schurter wrote:

> Jakub Steiner wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 2005-11-07 at 11:00 -0600, Michael Schurter wrote:
>>
>>> Hello all,
>>>
>>> I want to distribute some Tango icons with my GPL'd PHP project, 
>>> OpenIT[1], but as far as I can tell the Creative Commons Share-Alike 
>>> license is incompatible with the GPL.
>>>
>>> The FSF thinks its incompatible[2], and the Debian project does not 
>>> consider a free license.[3]
>>>
>>> However, since Tango icons are intended for use on GPL licensed 
>>> software such as Gnome & KDE, I suspect I'm not understanding 
>>> something.
>>>
>>> To summarize:
>>> Can Tango icons be distributed with a GPL project?
>>> If not what is there another suggested license to use for my project?
>>>
>>> Thanks for the great icon library,
>>> Michael Schurter
>>>
>>> [1] https://sourceforge.net/projects/openit
>>> [2] http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/license-list.html#OtherLicenses
>>> [3] http://people.debian.org/~evan/ccsummary.html
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Tango-artists mailing list
>>> Tango-artists at lists.freedesktop.org
>>> http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/tango-artists
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Michael,
>>
>> Since our own interpretations of the licenses don't really mean
>> anything, we have forwarded this to the Novell legal department. We'll
>> discuss the result of their analysis on the list.
>>
>> But if you're interested in my personal view on the matter, I believe
>> the spirit of both GPL and CC Share Alike is very similar. It is about
>> giving up some rights of the content creator to provide easier sharing
>> of the work. Both allow derivate works to be created and both include a
>> clause to always remain licensed in exactly the same terms.  If there
>> really are incompatibilities, I am convinced the CC and GPL people will
>> be interested in fixing them up as I cannot imagine free software
>> distributions would like to miss the opportunity to ship a growing
>> library of free content. This problem doesn't affect the Tango project
>> only, it is a lot broader.
>>
>> The reason we chose the CC SA was that it doesn't talk about code, but
>> (artistic) works. There are a few points I can make about the debian
>> analysis, but again I haven't studied law and I'm not experienced in the
>> field to really give these words any credibility:
>>
>>       * Both licenses have very similar goals - to provide freedoms to
>>         use, modify and distribute the work. The GPL unfortunately uses
>>         language specific to source code.       * None of the debian 
>> legal analysis talks about a major
>>         philosophical clash. It's all nuances, technical difficulties.
>>       * One of the nits in the debian legal analysis is the lacking
>>         ability to give proper credits as required by the CC SA license.
>>         We are currently embedding the license and authorship
>>         information in each single icon (not the bitmaps yet, but will
>>         be done as soon as the GIMP's metadata editor is in shape). I
>>         don't see a problem there.
>>       * I don't get the DRM agrument, the GPL is aiming at patents (in
>>         the next incarnation), the biggest showstopper for the free
>>         software movement. The EFF/free culture movement is aiming at
>>         DRM as the biggest showstopper for free media.
>>       * The logo trademark -- just like any other identity/logo, the
>>         clause allows to use it for showing the content is distributed
>>         under one of the CC licenses. I don't see why not being able to
>>         mess around with the logo makes the content non-GPL compatible.
>>         It doesn't seem to be a problem for Redhat Linux as it didn't
>>         seem to matter for Ximian GNOME distribution.
>>       * The CC SA have gone through at least two revisions (at v2.5
>>         now). The analysis appears to be based on v2.0.
>>
>> So to answer your question - having GPL and CC SA incompatible would be
>> a huge defeat for both the free software movement and the free culture
>> movement. My feeling is that *if* there really are problems, they
>> can/will be solved. Tango project may be the motivator to solve them.
>>
>> Yes, we want GPLed free software to ship with CC SA artwork and [3]
>> doesn't convince me you couldn't even before I have the reply from
>> Novell legal.
>>
>> cheers
>>
>
> Jakub,
>
> Thanks for the extremely thorough response.  As a supporter of the 
> free software and free culture movements I'm a bit dismayed at even 
> the appearance of incompatibilities - especially if its based on 
> technicalities.
>
> I will probably go ahead and use the Tango project's icons in my GPLed 
> project for the following reasons:
>
>     * As you stated, the philosophies of the two licenses are
>       similar, but their domains are different (media vs. software).
>     * As you stated, if there are technical incompatibilities, 
> I'm        
>       sure they will be resolved as its in the best interest of all
>       parties.
>     * I'm not worried about Debian considering my project
>       incompatible with the DFSG because OpenIT is a small project
>       and very easy to manually install.
>     * I'm not worried about cease and desist letters from any
>       copyright holders considering I'm doing what the copyright
>       holders involved (i.e. you) intended. ;-)
>     * If the worst-case-scenario does happen, and I'm forced to    
>       remove CC-SA licensed works from my project, I can always go
>       back to stealing icons from art.gnome.org.
>
> On the other hand I'm very interested to hear what the "official" word 
> is from Novell legal.  This is obviously a confusing and complex 
> issue, so it will be nice to leave it to the professionals.  ;-)
>
> Thanks once again for your helpful response, and thanks to all the 
> artists and engineers who have made the Tango project an excellent 
> resource.
>
> Sincerely,
> Michael
> _______________________________________________
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>
Oh, and Michael, if you need any extra icons, don't be afraid to ask for 
some.
I would be happy to make some for you.
- Andreas