Hello!
Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman)
raster at rasterman.com
Thu Oct 27 23:32:40 UTC 2016
On Thu, 27 Oct 2016 23:55:36 +0530 Rohit Burra <iamrohit7 at gmail.com> said:
> I am Rohit, a student at Vishnu Institute of Technology. I am interested in
> the Wayland project and would like to contribute. I can write code in C,
> Python. My GitHub profile: https://github.com/iamrohit7/ Can anyone please
> help me get started? I tried searching for beginner/easy bugs which most
> other projects have but couldn't find any.
my advice. "poke it and see how it wobbles" first. make a wayland client app
"from scratch with no toolkit other than libwayland-client to talk to a
compositor". get pixels on screen. update them. (maybe got for a shm client so
you have a bit more of a raw idea). then once you can get content... handle
input (kbd/mouse/whatever) and respond. keep going. add features. explore more
and more of protocol features (you'll figure this out by this point). you will
at some point get comfortable with how wayland works as a protocol. a lot f the
people if not most who work on wayland have spent YEARS working with things
like x11 (and have their likes and hates) and thus have a lot of experience. if
you are fresh to all of this (you haven't written toolkits or window
managers/compositors in x11) you have little experience to build on i guess and
so should build some. when you get to the above point you should begin to have
some todo-items magically on your own. most of the "todo items" now get driven
by specific app/compositor or "desktop env" needs. most projects are still
getting to having a complete solid wayland implementation (compositor and
client side in toolkits) and are busy restoring functionality they had under
x11 before.
> Thank you
>
> Cheers,
> Rohit
>
> On Oct 27, 2016 5:30 PM, <wayland-devel-request at lists.freedesktop.org>
> wrote:
>
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Kinetic scroll in libinput Xorg driver
> (Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman))
> 2. Re: Kinetic scroll in libinput Xorg driver
> (Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman))
> 3. Re: Kinetic scroll in libinput Xorg driver (Silvan Jegen)
> 4. Re: Kinetic scroll in libinput Xorg driver (Carlos Garnacho)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 11:10:58 +0900
> From: Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) <raster at rasterman.com>
> To: Christian Stroetmann <stroetmann at ontolab.com>
> Cc: "Alexis BRENON @Wayland" <brenon.alexis+wayland at gmail.com>,
> wayland-devel at lists.freedesktop.org
> Subject: Re: Kinetic scroll in libinput Xorg driver
> Message-ID: <20161027111058.194287583206f24ddb5eade7 at rasterman.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 14:14:13 +0200 Christian Stroetmann
> <stroetmann at ontolab.com> said:
>
> > On 26.10.2016 08:57, Alexis BRENON @Wayland wrote:
> >
> > @Raster: Thank you for your reminder.
> >
> > Maybe Enlightenment with Tiling2 and kinetic scrolling is already what
> > you need.
>
> yes. and then load the tiling module (and enable tiling for the desktops you
> want it on etc. - in tiling settings).
>
> > If I remember correctly I3 (www.i3wm.org)<http://i3wm.org/> might work
> > together with Wayland as well.
>
> possibly might work too.
>
> > In general, I have seen at all major toolkits transistion efforts to
> > Wayland since around 2 years. Some have matured while others are
> > experimental so to say.
>
> indeed.
>
> > Best Regards
> > Christian Stroetmann
> >
> > > Just to be sure that I understand clearly, what you call 'Toolkit' is
> > > libraries like GTK, Qt, and co. that are used by developers to build
> > > their apps, isn't it ?
> > >
> > > Finally, do you know some tiling DE/WM Wayland compliant ?
> > >
> > > Kind,
> > > Alexis.
> > >
> > > Le mer. 26 oct. 2016 à 02:17, Carsten Haitzler <raster at rasterman.com
> > > <mailto:raster at rasterman.com>> a écrit :
> > >
> > > On Mon, 24 Oct 2016 18:42:31 +0000 "Alexis BRENON @Wayland"
> > > <brenon.alexis
> > > +wayland at gmail.com <mailto:wayland at gmail.com>> said:
> > >
> > > > Hello everyone,
> > > >
> > > > I would like to implement kinetic scroll in the libinput driver
> > > for Xorg.
> > > >
> > > > I know that it's probably not the intended use of libinput ; as
> > > explained
> > > > in the documentation, it's the client that have to manage that.
> > > >
> > > > However, as an Xorg user not happy with the synaptics driver, I
> > > would like
> > > > to add a similar feature (fixing small disagreements encountered
> > > with
> > > > synaptics) to libinput, allowing Xorg users to easily move to
> > > libinput
> > > > without losing this feature.
> > > >
> > > > My first idea is to implement the kinetic scroll using a thread
> > > that sends
> > > > axis events as long as there is no button event, key event or
> > > motion event
> > > > higher than a threshold.
> > > >
> > > > It makes some time since the last time I developed in C, and
> > > maybe it's not
> > > > the better way to do it. I would be happy to hear your advices.
> > > >
> > > > One thing I'm thinking of is then to add some options in the Xorg
> > > > configuration file to enable/disable this feature, choose the
> events
> > > > stopping the kinetic scroll and change some thresholds. This
> > > will allow to
> > > > easily disable this feature in the future in case the clients
> > > manage the
> > > > kinetic scroll on their own.
> > > >
> > > > What do you think of this? Is there someone already working on
> > > it? Is my
> > > > proposition a good way to implement it?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks for your attention.
> > > >
> > > > Kind regards,
> > > > Alexis BRENON.
> > >
> > > we already do kinetic scrolling higher up in the toolkit. we do
> > > acceleration
> > > using these events and we do smooth animated scrolling in our
> > > scroller and not
> > > just stepping, as well as momentum as we slid with bouncing at the
> > > ends. it's
> > > already done in toolkit out of the box. if you try and hack this
> > > in at the
> > > input layer this simply doubles the amount of this and likely
> > > makes the user
> > > experience worse. this would have to be off by default and if it's
> > > off by
> > > default... you need ways of turning it on client by client ... and
> > > even then
> > > there are a pile of other problems you'll hit. so my suggestion is
> > > - don't. add
> > > to your favorite toolkits instead if they don't have it. they have
> > > far more
> > > information about the context at the time and the use cases needed
> > > etc.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > ------------- Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am"
> > > --------------
> > > The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler) raster at rasterman.com
> > > <mailto:raster at rasterman.com>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > wayland-devel mailing list
> > > wayland-devel at lists.freedesktop.org
> > > https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/wayland-devel
> >
>
>
> --
> ------------- Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" --------------
> The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler) raster at rasterman.com
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 11:11:01 +0900
> From: Carsten Haitzler (The Rasterman) <raster at rasterman.com>
> To: "Alexis BRENON @Wayland" <brenon.alexis+wayland at gmail.com>
> Cc: wayland-devel at lists.freedesktop.org
> Subject: Re: Kinetic scroll in libinput Xorg driver
> Message-ID: <20161027111101.d8b03ab309089c7115e18577 at rasterman.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 06:57:53 +0000 "Alexis BRENON @Wayland" <brenon.alexis
> +wayland at gmail.com> said:
>
> > Just to be sure that I understand clearly, what you call 'Toolkit' is
> > libraries like GTK, Qt, and co. that are used by developers to build their
> > apps, isn't it ?
>
> yes. toolkit == EFL, Qt, GTK+ and others (SDL is kind of a toolkit), FLTK,
> ...
> chromium/blink is basically a toolkit of its own etc.
>
> at least looking at gtk3 here it doesn't do momentum with wheel/axis
> scrolling
> (out of the box). maybe it needs enabling? qt - same story. (not in standard
> scrollable regions like in the file selector) but efl's scrollable regions
> do
> silky smooth scrolling with momentum out of the box when you scroll your
> wheel
> around - also as long as thumbsrcoll is enabled (it is on mobile profile)
> click
> and drag to do the same like on mobile devices - with momentum when
> releasing.
>
> my point here is - if you go mess with the input events as they actually
> come
> from a device, it will totally mess with this kind of code that is doing all
> the smoothing, interpolation and animated momentum already. it isn't the
> job of
> a low level input event to go and try and pretend to have events it does
> not to
> try and produce these kinds of effects which are already done at the toolkit
> level by at least 1 toolkit, and the input device doesn't have the context
> information a toolkit has to know when to stop, bounce back, or just do
> this in
> steps rather than with momentum (eg with a slider widget).
>
> > Finally, do you know some tiling DE/WM Wayland compliant ?
>
> yes. enlightenment with tiling module enabled will do this. tiling module
> is a
> bit rough, but people do use it.
>
> > Kind,
> > Alexis.
> >
> > Le mer. 26 oct. 2016 à 02:17, Carsten Haitzler <raster at rasterman.com> a
> > écrit :
> >
> > > On Mon, 24 Oct 2016 18:42:31 +0000 "Alexis BRENON @Wayland"
> <brenon.alexis
> > > +wayland at gmail.com> said:
> > >
> > > > Hello everyone,
> > > >
> > > > I would like to implement kinetic scroll in the libinput driver for
> Xorg.
> > > >
> > > > I know that it's probably not the intended use of libinput ; as
> explained
> > > > in the documentation, it's the client that have to manage that.
> > > >
> > > > However, as an Xorg user not happy with the synaptics driver, I would
> > > like
> > > > to add a similar feature (fixing small disagreements encountered with
> > > > synaptics) to libinput, allowing Xorg users to easily move to libinput
> > > > without losing this feature.
> > > >
> > > > My first idea is to implement the kinetic scroll using a thread that
> > > sends
> > > > axis events as long as there is no button event, key event or motion
> > > event
> > > > higher than a threshold.
> > > >
> > > > It makes some time since the last time I developed in C, and maybe
> it's
> > > not
> > > > the better way to do it. I would be happy to hear your advices.
> > > >
> > > > One thing I'm thinking of is then to add some options in the Xorg
> > > > configuration file to enable/disable this feature, choose the events
> > > > stopping the kinetic scroll and change some thresholds. This will
> allow
> > > to
> > > > easily disable this feature in the future in case the clients manage
> the
> > > > kinetic scroll on their own.
> > > >
> > > > What do you think of this? Is there someone already working on it? Is
> my
> > > > proposition a good way to implement it?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks for your attention.
> > > >
> > > > Kind regards,
> > > > Alexis BRENON.
> > >
> > > we already do kinetic scrolling higher up in the toolkit. we do
> > > acceleration
> > > using these events and we do smooth animated scrolling in our scroller
> and
> > > not
> > > just stepping, as well as momentum as we slid with bouncing at the ends.
> > > it's
> > > already done in toolkit out of the box. if you try and hack this in at
> the
> > > input layer this simply doubles the amount of this and likely makes the
> > > user
> > > experience worse. this would have to be off by default and if it's off
> by
> > > default... you need ways of turning it on client by client ... and even
> > > then
> > > there are a pile of other problems you'll hit. so my suggestion is -
> > > don't. add
> > > to your favorite toolkits instead if they don't have it. they have far
> more
> > > information about the context at the time and the use cases needed etc.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > ------------- Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" --------------
> > > The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler) raster at rasterman.com
> > >
> > >
>
>
> --
> ------------- Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" --------------
> The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler) raster at rasterman.com
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 09:31:19 +0200
> From: Silvan Jegen <s.jegen at gmail.com>
> To: "Alexis BRENON @Wayland" <brenon.alexis+wayland at gmail.com>
> Cc: "wayland-devel at lists.freedesktop.org"
> <wayland-devel at lists.freedesktop.org>, Carsten Haitzler
> <raster at rasterman.com>
> Subject: Re: Kinetic scroll in libinput Xorg driver
> Message-ID:
> <CAKvUva-AyjnjT3WrJ+RBqQthHq6eh7LUUn9_Ce=SJ+it8c5j7A at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 8:57 AM, Alexis BRENON @Wayland
> <brenon.alexis+wayland at gmail.com> wrote:
> > Finally, do you know some tiling DE/WM Wayland compliant ?
>
> The two that come to mind are:
>
> https://github.com/michaelforney/velox Velox: a Wayland port of dwm
> with minimal dependencies
>
> http://swaywm.org/ Sway: which is a port of i3 to Wayland IIRC
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Silvan
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 11:51:00 +0200
> From: Carlos Garnacho <carlosg at gnome.org>
> To: Carsten Haitzler <raster at rasterman.com>
> Cc: "Alexis BRENON @Wayland" <brenon.alexis+wayland at gmail.com>,
> "wayland-devel at lists.freedesktop.org"
> <wayland-devel at lists.freedesktop.org>
> Subject: Re: Kinetic scroll in libinput Xorg driver
> Message-ID:
> <CAEiaqW3kYedbkoQN7Fp68gaspmWcYZ7rjh15-aK_8QjGwkDVbA at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> Hey Carsten!,
>
> On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 4:11 AM, Carsten Haitzler <raster at rasterman.com>
> wrote:
> > On Wed, 26 Oct 2016 06:57:53 +0000 "Alexis BRENON @Wayland" <brenon.alexis
> > +wayland at gmail.com> said:
> >
> >> Just to be sure that I understand clearly, what you call 'Toolkit' is
> >> libraries like GTK, Qt, and co. that are used by developers to build
> their
> >> apps, isn't it ?
> >
> > yes. toolkit == EFL, Qt, GTK+ and others (SDL is kind of a toolkit),
> FLTK, ...
> > chromium/blink is basically a toolkit of its own etc.
> >
> > at least looking at gtk3 here it doesn't do momentum with wheel/axis
> scrolling
> > (out of the box). maybe it needs enabling?
>
> FWIW, that should happen out of the box whenever we got
> wl_pointer.axis_stop on both axes:
> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/tree/gtk/gtkscrolledwindow.c#n3399
>
> The usual caveats apply, that doesn't help if the app plays smart and
> tries to implement its own scroller widget.
>
> Cheers,
> Carlos
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
> _______________________________________________
> wayland-devel mailing list
> wayland-devel at lists.freedesktop.org
> https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/wayland-devel
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of wayland-devel Digest, Vol 74, Issue 45
> *********************************************
--
------------- Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" --------------
The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler) raster at rasterman.com
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