Notification spec issue: Ability to assign an icon *and* an image to a notification
Aaron J. Seigo
aseigo at kde.org
Wed Jun 24 13:10:36 PDT 2009
On Wednesday 24 June 2009, you wrote:
> Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > the correctness issue:
> > these are not notifications, they are a subset of notifications. what do
> > we call a spec that actually does notifications? FullNotifications? there
> > is no point in collaborating if there is no collaboration, and in this
> > case it's pretty evident that the service is incorrectly named which will
> > lead to a pretty jangled system later on.
> In fact I just realized the name can be considered correct. After all,
> this spec defines a notification as composed of an icon, an image, a
> title, a summary and a sound. Sure the icon and the image are only
> visual, but nothing prevents someone from implementing a text-to-speech
> server which would play the summary, title and sound.
please see knotify for a full treatment of notifications as a system. sure, we
can play semantic games if we wish, but let's not.
> > if it's a painful exercise in learning what collaboration actually means
> > for those who jumped on org.freedesktop.Notifications, so be it. perhaps
> > in future people will take it this all a bit more seriously and exercise
> > responsible behaviour instead of laissez faire cowboyism. it would
> > certainly help with the legitimacy of fd.o as a shared organ.
> So, in order to punish people who incorrectly used the org.freedesktop
> namespace, you want to impose a rewrite to everyone involved? I am
that's something they should have seriously considered in advance.
we can certainly push org.freedesktop.Notifications through if that's the will
of this body. it gets the user what they need/want in the shortest route
however, it means supporting and condoning behavior that is not collaborative,
shared or trustable. freedesktop.org _must_ be trustable as a collaboration
facilitator, and not the "first come, first serve, what's the will of the
hegemony" political pot it has become. we had the opportunity in this last
year or two to move beyond that, but as is becoming more and more apparent,
it's not going to happen.
in this particular case my team put in a good amount of effort to go far more
than half way towards getting this specification shared amongst more parties.
after having our input ignored summarily for some years, including on this
very list, we finally just went ahead and implemented something pretty close
with some improvements to address some small deficiencies in the spec that we
we signficantly adjusted our notification systems to pragmatically solve the
issue, and then we started the whole "can we PLEASE get this standardized"
push again. visual notification interoperability would have remained
completely moribund and unsettled without that happening. there was no
outreach, no cooperating and next to no collaboration made available to us.
our requests are now generally dismissed with "well, it's too late now." this
is a direct result of galago moving forward as they saw fit and rewards, even
institutionalizes, that mode of operation. this, by definition, is a non-
collaborative event with no benefit for future participation demonstrated. we
can certainly go the route of "fight for de facto standard status" if we wish
in the F/OSS desktop world, but we don't need freedesktop.org for that.
i really don't want to see this effort end poorly, and i will ensure that the
user gets what they need and deserve in this case, including settling on
org.freedesktop.Notification if need be. and to be honest i don't regret any
of the effort we've put into this so far.
however, the result certainly reflects upon fd.o and it will guide my future
involvement with fd.o.
i have no interest in playing games. i'd like to have a place to work on
standardization. if need be, other places can be found to work on shared
technologies with people who are actually interested in doing so in a
collaborative manner, treating shared resources with respect and trust.
Aurelien: i know this is not a situation you created and you are simply trying
to make good things happen for the user. i respect that and appreciate your
efforts. i mean: patches, who can ask for anything more, right? it sucks that
you get to stand in the middle of it at the moment, and i certainly do not
think you are responsible in the least for this situation. ... just so that's
Aaron J. Seigo
humru othro a kohnu se
GPG Fingerprint: 8B8B 2209 0C6F 7C47 B1EA EE75 D6B7 2EB1 A7F1 DB43
KDE core developer sponsored by Qt Software
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