<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:x="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:excel" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> <head> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"> <meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)"> <style></style> </head> <body lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"> <div class="WordSection1"> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Hi,<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">The problem seems to be that Icon is unique among the currently-defined keys in that it identifies a _machine-actionable_ datum that may conceivably want / need to differ between locales. It should not be translated because it’s not intended for human readers, but it should be customizable on a per-locale basis. For example, it would probably be appropriate for a “fix it” icon depicted in Western European locales as a red cross to be depicted in middle eastern locales as a red crescent.<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Whereas I concur that such cases are at best rare in practice, I suggest that if a change is to be made at all then the alternative of creating a new value type should at least be considered. That would permit the locale-customizability to be retained while clarifying the intended use and distinguishing such items from those that should routinely be translated.<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">John<o:p></o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p> <div> <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"> <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"> xdg [mailto:xdg-bounces@lists.freedesktop.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Will Thompson<br> <b>Sent:</b> Monday, June 24, 2019 5:06 PM<br> <b>To:</b> xdg@lists.freedesktop.org<br> <b>Subject:</b> Reclassify Icon= in .desktop files as string, not localestring<o:p></o:p></span></p> </div> </div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> <p class="MsoNormal" style="line-height:12.0pt;background:white"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#C10F3A">Caution: External Sender<o:p></o:p></span></b></p> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> <div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Hi, <o:p></o:p></p> <div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Currently, Icon= and similar fields in .desktop files are defined to be "localestring", and are extracted for translation by tools like xgettext. I propose to redefine them to "string" <a href="https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgitlab.freedesktop.org%2Fxdg%2Fxdg-specs%2Fmerge_requests%2F2&data=01%7C01%7CJohn.Bollinger%40stjude.org%7C8abdeafc250043b65f6d08d6f8f02d66%7C22340fa892264871b677d3b3e377af72%7C0&sdata=8LwCUiY37LU9BYzXCrmcGwcUUvVKMieCS79hi39yO00%3D&reserved=0">https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/xdg/xdg-specs/merge_requests/2</a> and stop xgettext extracting them. <a href="https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fsavannah.gnu.org%2Fbugs%2Findex.php%3F56543&data=01%7C01%7CJohn.Bollinger%40stjude.org%7C8abdeafc250043b65f6d08d6f8f02d66%7C22340fa892264871b677d3b3e377af72%7C0&sdata=s27GFtsB%2B4tdqWRcj9apJpempzlBjzTmBQfzhfMtVuM%3D&reserved=0">https://savannah.gnu.org/bugs/index.php?56543</a><o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">I did some cursory archaeology and the only discussion I can find around icons being translatable is this message <a href="https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.freedesktop.org%2Farchives%2Fxdg%2F2005-June%2F005364.html&data=01%7C01%7CJohn.Bollinger%40stjude.org%7C8abdeafc250043b65f6d08d6f8f02d66%7C22340fa892264871b677d3b3e377af72%7C0&sdata=hJHmTK8DbuIuvZ4Cxv7JRu2tizarX9Ka3aQfQ9R9Fac%3D&reserved=0">https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/xdg/2005-June/005364.html</a> and its descendents. The argument given there is:<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <blockquote style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in"> <p class="MsoNormal">I think Icon is intentionally a localestring - you might imagine an icon having some text or a cultural reference. I don't think it would be a good idea to have an icon like that and I haven't seen a localized Icon key in practice but ...<o:p></o:p></p> </blockquote> <div> <div> <div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">I agree with everything here – technically, it's correct to make them localizable, even if I have never noticed a localised icon. (That said, English is my first and only language, and I live in the UK…)<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">On the other hand, I have seen translators trying hard to translate icon names, which are often strange collections of kebab-case-words or com.example.reverse_domain.Words. I've seen many comments of the form "# TRANSLATORS: please do not translate this".<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Is there widespread use of localized icons that I'm not aware of? If so, perhaps the right path is to add a flag to xgettext to opt in (or opt out) of this behaviour; this might not be an easy sell since the specification is clear that these are localestrings. If not, could we consider this a case where the practical cost (in the form of wasted work for translators) outweighs the conceptual upside, and change the spec (and implementation)?<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p> </div> <p class="MsoNormal">– Will<o:p></o:p></p> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </div> <br> <hr> <font face="Arial" color="Gray" size="2"><br> Email Disclaimer: www.stjude.org/emaildisclaimer<br> Consultation Disclaimer: www.stjude.org/consultationdisclaimer<br> </font> </body> </html>