x.org is Hacker Trash

[Alex Deucher]

On 3/29/07, Gene Heskett <gene.heskett at verizon.net> wrote:
> On Thursday 29 March 2007, Alex Deucher wrote:
> >On 3/29/07, Joseph Parmelee <jparmele at wildbear.com> wrote:
> >> On Thu, 29 Mar 2007, xorg sucks wrote:
> >> > I had spent so much of my life on this TRAIN WRECK of
> >> > a project that it was virtually painless to make an
> >> > account specifically for this email.
> >>
> >> Follows a rant, more than a bit rude, but let's not use that as an
> >> excuse to avoid noticing the many valid points.
> >>
> >> > (1) Make an easily navigable site with consistent
> >> > build instructions.
> >> >
> >> > (2) Concentrate on one method of distribution.
> >> >
> >> > (3) Only offer individual tarballs for those who know
> >> > what they're doing.
> >> >
> >> > (4) Setup (easily findable) branches in your
> >> > repository; don't even allow changes to the unstable
> >> > repository unless the whole thing compiles.
> >> >
> >> > (5) Make it easy. Good Lord! I can compile a frickin'
> >> > OS Kernel without a sweat. What the hell is X Windows?
> >>
> >> The linux kernel project, arguably the gold standard of open source
> >> projects, puts up release candidates for testing which can be quite
> >> easily built by persons with only a modicum of experience.  Why is
> >> that important? Because it permits widescale testing of all the
> >> various different hardware out there.
> >>
> >> There's more to a display system than just a video chip.  No one
> >> person or group, regardless of their size and degree of diligence, can
> >> possibly test their code on the vast number of different hardware
> >> combinations out there without help, particularly when the problem is
> >> complicated by ill-documented and possibly buggy chips, monitors,
> >> adapter cards, mother boards, and BIOS'es.  It is essential that the
> >> release candidates get the widest possible distribution for exactly
> >> this reason.  Not only will the X project be benefitted, but so will
> >> the hardware manufacturers as their bugs/features will more quickly be
> >> discovered and documented.
> >>
> >> I have been maintaining a private distribution for the past five
> >> years, using literally hundreds of different upstream build systems
> >> and code repositories.  I have to say that Xorg has the absolute worst
> >> of all open source projects with which I am acquainted, by a clear
> >> margin.  It makes mozilla look positively enlightened.  At least they
> >> have a tarball and a build script (even if they insist on
> >> mis-documenting its configure options).
> >>
> >> I'm not arguing with the value of modularization from a developers'
> >> standpoint, but PLEASE devote the appropriate resources to putting
> >> together usable releases with a master script that allows the unwashed
> >> to build this mess.  There is a vast sea of highly experienced
> >> developers out there who don't happen to be X experts.  They are
> >> exactly the people who could most help you, but they don't have time
> >> to play adventure; they have their own projects to tend.  If they
> >> don't build your release candidate because they can't spare the time
> >> to figure it out, you lose the significant benefit of tests they could
> >> run on their hardware, and the help they could give you in finding and
> >> patching the bugs.
> >
> >I want to build the latest redhat from scratch, but downloading all
> >the src rpm packages is a PITA.  Why isn't there just a big redhat
> >package I can download and to build the whole distro?  Talk about
> >non-user friendly...
> >
> >Seriously, X isn't that hard to build.  When we had the monolith
> >people complained because they had to rebuild the whole thing just to
> >build the latest radeon driver.  Now the opposite is true.  We can't
> >win ;)
> >
> >There are several pages on the wiki that describe the building
> >process, and if you have questions, fell free to ask; that's why we
> >have this list.   And if you figure out a way of building everything
> >that works for you, add it to the wiki rather than expecting some
> >developer to add it; it's a wiki after all!
> >
> >Alex
>
> Ok Alex, how about a link to this greatest of all wiki's please?

her are a few off the top of my head...

http://wiki.x.org/wiki/ModularDevelopersGuide
http://wiki.x.org/wiki/CompileXserverManually
http://wiki.freedesktop.org/wiki/UsingGit

Alex