[gst-devel] Daily IRC logs

[wim.taymans at chello.be]

[06:36] <taaz> 160k irc log mailing... maybe that should just be archived to the web site or something
[06:36] <omega_> did he send that to the list?
[06:36] <omega_> or that's #gstreamer?
[06:37] <taaz> it happens every day ya know
[06:37] <taaz> that's todays #gstreamer
[06:37] <omega_> right.  he also sent me a .gz of a #gnome log that was exactly 160KB
[06:38] <omega_> you have the logs already?
[06:38] <Parapraxi> can someone check the file 'tools/gstream-launcher.c' and tell me what memcpy() line after argvn = g_new0 (char *,argc); is? 
[06:38] <taaz> it was just mailed...
[06:38] Action: Parapraxi deleted it :(
[06:38] <omega_> it's in cvs ;-)
[06:38] <omega_> gstreamer.net/cvs/
[06:39] <Parapraxi> ah, ok
[06:39] <omega_> very useful resource
[06:39] <omega_> taaz: I'll get worried when the log size starts to trigger mailman's message-size limits <g>
[06:40] <omega_> of course, I don't have it yet ;-(
[06:40] <taaz> well... maybe a seperate list for it or something... you're going to scare off people who get upset at such things
[06:40] <omega_> could be
[06:41] <omega_> hrm, still don't have it
[06:42] <omega_> I thought it went out at 00:00 -0500 ?
[06:42] <taaz> Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 06:28:27 +0200
[06:43] <omega_> 15+min ago
[06:45] <omega_> got it
[06:52] ajmitch (ajmitch at p39-max6.dun.ihug.co.nz) joined #gstreamer.
[06:52] <omega_> yo
[06:52] <ajmitch> hey
[06:53] <ajmitch> musta had a power spike or something - computer was off when i got to it
[06:53] <omega_> oops
[06:53] <ajmitch> and other computer had rebooted
[06:57] ajmitch (ajmitch at p39-max6.dun.ihug.co.nz) left irc: Ping timeout for ajmitch[p39-max6.dun.ihug.co.nz]
[07:19] arik (arik at sdn-ar-002waseatP320.dialsprint.net) joined #gstreamer.
[07:19] <arik> hey all
[07:20] <omega_> yo
[07:20] <arik> so i don't seem to have write access
[07:20] <arik> on the cvs server
[07:21] <omega_> hrm
[07:21] <omega_> you used a cvs root like omegahacker at cvs.gstreamer.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/gstreamer
[07:21] <arik> yep
[07:21] <omega_> hrm
[07:21] <omega_> worked for hadess....
[07:21] <arik> :pserver:
[07:22] <omega_> nope
[07:22] <arik> but tyeah
[07:22] <arik> oh
[07:22] <arik> !
[07:22] <arik> ssh
[07:22] <omega_> very much nope
[07:22] <arik> i see
[07:22] <arik> ok
[07:22] <arik> np
[07:22] <arik> got it
[07:25] <omega_> anyone know of a machine architecture for which the stack grows UPwards?
[07:25] <arik> i don't
[07:25] <arik> think i do
[07:25] <omega_> and has access to such a machine running gcc to run a test on?
[07:26] <arik> hehe
[07:26] <taaz> are you actively seeking out problems now?
[07:26] <omega_> yes
[07:27] <arik> cvs server: cannot add file on non-branch tag HEAD
[07:27] <omega_> I'm writing a test package to distribute so we can a) see how well cothreads work and b) fix them on archs for which they don't
[07:27] <omega_> hmmm?
[07:27] <arik> that's what i get
[07:27] <arik> with cvs add
[07:27] <omega_> odd
[07:28] <taaz> well... distribute with a stack size growth direction test from Pth  (in one of the .m4s i think) and see if anyone notices
[07:28] <omega_> you did a plain checkout?
[07:28] <arik> no, cvs up
[07:28] <omega_> taaz: why? I just wrote one, it's easy
[07:28] <omega_> arik: cvs update on what?
[07:28] <arik> omega_: gstplay
[07:28] <omega_> from what?
[07:28] <arik> maybe i should just check out again
[07:28] <omega_> yes
[07:28] <arik> HEAD
[07:29] <omega_> you can't change the cvsroot after it's checked out unless you know magic
[07:29] <arik> right
[07:33] <taaz> its not magic... i have a script to do it
[07:34] <omega_> it's still magic <g>
[07:34] <taaz> yeah... find + sed == magic ;)
[07:34] <omega_> yeah yeah ;-)
[07:34] <omega_> you have to know what to change
[07:45] Action: Parapraxi is falling asleep & writing very silly code
[07:45] <omega_> oops
[07:47] <arik> added an AUTHORS file to gstplay
[07:47] <arik> finally
[07:47] <Parapraxi> I'm removing all the \'s from the cmdline by moving every character forward by the number of escape sequences seen
[07:47] <omega_> heh
[07:48] <omega_> taaz: didn't you commit that patch to cothreads.[ch] ?
[07:51] <Parapraxi> enough... I'm going to sleep... later y'all
[07:51] Parapraxi (Spluzz at user-2ivedos.dialup.mindspring.com) left irc: Client Exiting
[07:51] <taaz> i did
[07:52] <taaz> in head
[07:52] <omega_> hmmm
[07:52] <omega_> hrm, ok, there it is
[08:00] <omega_> gstreamer.net/cothread-test.tar.gz
[08:00] <omega_> first pass, not complete
[08:07] <omega_> taaz: I implemented a functionally identical test to Pth, even down to the choice of 10 recursions (as opposed to 9 or 11 <g>)
[08:07] <omega_> I did it much cleaner though
[08:07] <taaz> send them a patch
[08:08] <omega_> heh
[08:08] <taaz>   Approx. size per recursive call: 0
[08:08] <taaz> ?
[08:08] <omega_> hrm
[08:08] <taaz> Attempting to overfill pthread stack
[08:08] <taaz> Floating point exception
[08:08] <omega_> neat
[08:08] <omega_> can you paste the first line?
[08:08] <taaz> Current stack frame is 0xbffff9db, 100 functions deep it is 0xbffff9da
[08:09] <omega_> hrm
[08:09] <omega_> oh
[08:09] <omega_> sed s/-O6/-O2/ Makefile
[08:10] <taaz> Current stack frame is 0xbffff9db, 100 functions deep it is 0xbffff9ab
[08:10] <omega_> um
[08:10] <omega_> make clean?
[08:10] <taaz> y
[08:10] <omega_> hrm
[08:10] <omega_> odd
[08:10] <taaz> works ok with -O0
[08:10] <omega_> suck
[08:10] <omega_> gcc3?
[08:11] <taaz> 2.95.4
[08:11] <omega_> 2.96
[08:11] <omega_> how many bytes?
[08:11] <taaz> -rwxr-xr-x    1 dlehn    dlehn       10011 May 20 02:11 cothread-test*
[08:12] <omega_> no, how many bytes per call?
[08:12] <taaz> heh
[08:12] Action: omega_ thwacks taaz
[08:12] <taaz>   Approx. size per recursive call: 48
[08:12] <omega_> wow
[08:12] Action: omega_ has 2
[08:12] <omega_> er, 28
[08:12] <taaz> well that was -O0
[08:12] <taaz>   After switch, we should never arrive here!
[08:12] <omega_> 28
[08:12] <omega_> right, remove the last line <g>
[08:14] <omega_> taaz: try changing the CURRENT_STACK_FRAME in cothreads.h to 'auto int __csf;&__csf;'
[08:14] <omega_> then compile with -O6
[08:16] <taaz> nope
[08:16] <omega_> hrm
[08:16] <omega_> bleck
[08:18] <taaz> let me know if you want the -S compile output ;)
[08:19] <omega_> erm, not just yet <g>
[08:19] <omega_> I'm pretty certain it's just optimizing it away
[08:19] Action: taaz will brb
[08:34] <taaz> fix it yet? ;)
[08:37] <omega_> no, I'm reading up on this stuff
[08:38] <omega_> the main problem is that M:N threads don't imply that the app has control over where the user-space threads live
[08:38] <omega_> and that's critical to how we use them
[08:39] <omega_> I'm gonna join the IBM mlist and start discussing that with them
[08:40] <taaz> i looked at their release notes... something about "only works on x86 and foobar at the moment"... well... how is that any improvement over what we have now? ;)
[08:40] <omega_> it isn't, but that's not the point
[08:40] <omega_> interesting: IBM OSS lists are hosted on oss.lotus.com, by mailman <g>
[08:51] <arik> argh!!!!!!!!!!
[08:51] <omega_> no, argc and argv....
[08:51] <arik> i have got to get alsa working on this machine
[08:51] <arik> hehe
[08:51] <omega_> arg-hex ?
[08:51] <arik> heh
[08:51] <arik> this is so frustrating
[08:51] <omega_> what, oss sucking?
[08:51] <arik> cause i'm using the demo oss-non-free crap
[08:51] <arik> oss doesn't work with my card
[08:51] <arik> unless you pay
[08:52] <omega_> bleck
[08:52] <arik> and alsa says they support it
[08:52] <arik> and install fine
[08:52] <arik> and run without any error
[08:52] <arik> except
[08:52] <omega_> no sound
[08:52] <arik> yep
[08:52] <taaz> cheaper to buy a supported card isnt it?
[08:52] <arik> even after unmuting
[08:52] <arik> not for a laptop
[08:52] <omega_> alsa made the decision to mute on insmod
[08:52] <omega_> hrm, ok
[08:52] <arik> yeah
[08:52] <arik> i unmute
[08:58] <arik> very  veryv ery very very annoying
[08:59] <omega_> have you emailed the alsa ppl?
[08:59] <arik> not yet, i should
[08:59] <arik> i should search there help board first
[09:03] taaz (dlehn at 66.37.66.32) got netsplit.
[09:03] mattsm (mattsm at adsl-216-62-180-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) got netsplit.
[09:04] taaz (dlehn at 66.37.66.32) returned to #gstreamer.
[09:06] <omega_> post to IBM's pthreads through sent, cc'd to gst-devel
[09:06] Nick change: omega_ -> omega_away
[09:06] <taaz> omega_away: gcc is being too tricky with your code.  it doesnt actually do recursive calls for the stack dir check... just does jumps.
[09:07] <omega_away> mu
[09:07] <taaz> probably some tail recursion optimization thing
[09:07] <taaz> if only i understood that ;)
[09:08] <omega_away> just do something after the recursive call ;-)
[09:08] <omega_away> printf(">") and "<" would do the trick
[09:10] mattsm (mattsm at adsl-216-62-180-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) returned to #gstreamer.
[09:14] Nick change: taaz -> taazzzz
[09:18] ajmitch (ajmitch at p38-max2.dun.ihug.co.nz) joined #gstreamer.
[09:19] <arik> hey
[09:20] <ajmitch> hey
[09:20] <ajmitch> hopefully computer will keep running ;)
[09:20] <arik> ;-)
[09:20] <ajmitch> had about 3 power outages here tonight
[09:21] <arik> suck
[09:22] <ajmitch> well, i'm not really using my computer tonight, so no matter really ;)
[09:22] <arik> heh
[09:22] <arik> i'm annoyed about my lack of alsa
[09:22] <arik> other then that i'm just chatting
[09:22] <arik> and trying to help a friend with her camera
[09:22] <arik> yes that friend omega_away 
[09:22] <arik> but with a different problem
[09:22] mattsm (mattsm at adsl-216-62-180-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) got netsplit.
[09:23] mattsm (mattsm at adsl-216-62-180-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) returned to #gstreamer.
[09:27] mattsm (mattsm at adsl-216-62-180-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) got netsplit.
[09:27] mattsm (mattsm at adsl-216-62-180-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) returned to #gstreamer.
[09:29] ajmitch (ajmitch at p38-max2.dun.ihug.co.nz) left irc: Ping timeout for ajmitch[p38-max2.dun.ihug.co.nz]
[09:42] ajmitch (ajmitch at p51-max6.dun.ihug.co.nz) joined #gstreamer.
[09:43] <arik> wb
[09:43] <arik> more power out?
[10:24] omega_away (omega at omegacs.net) left irc: [x]chat
[11:06] iGN_ (ign at login1.simplemente.net) left irc: Ping timeout for iGN_[login1.simplemente.net]
[11:06] iGN_ (ign at login1.simplemente.net) joined #gstreamer.
[11:35] <arik> simplemente!
[11:41] steveb (steveb at node1ee0a.a2000.nl) joined #gstreamer.
[11:57] Nick change: wtay-zZz -> wtay
[11:57] <wtay> yawn
[11:57] <arik> morning
[11:57] <wtay> 'morning
[11:59] <steveb> yo
[11:59] <arik> dum de dum
[11:59] <arik> hey
[11:59] <wtay> yo
[12:08] <ajmitch> hmm
[12:08] Action: ajmitch should test memory now
[12:11] <thomas> morning all
[12:13] <ajmitch> morning thomas
[12:14] <wtay> morning
[12:14] Action: ajmitch should unpatch automake and try & build gstreamer
[12:14] <thomas> I'm going to give glib another try on macosx
[12:14] <thomas> wtay: I'm almost ready for my tutoring session ;)
[12:14] <ajmitch> good luck ;)
[12:14] <wtay> thomas: hmm ok, I'll let you know when I am :)
[12:16] <ajmitch> thomas: tutoring for what? ;)
[12:17] Nick change: arik -> arik|food
[12:22] <thomas> ajmitch: for caps nego stuff so that I can rewrite my plugins
[12:26] <ajmitch> thomas: ah, good, i should listen in then... ;)
[12:26] <thomas> wtay: first question so I can get up to speed : work in HEAD or INCSCHED ?
[12:27] <wtay> good question...
[12:27] <thomas> I know ;) I would have hoped it had been merged by now ?
[12:27] <thomas> lots of issues left, or is omega wrapping it up ?
[12:27] <arik|food> i use HEAD
[12:28] <arik|food> but that's cause gstplay is broken in INCSHED
[12:28] <wtay> I suggest you work in HEAD if you write new plugins, for apps you should use INCSCHED
[12:28] <arik|food> and i don't feel like fixing it
[12:28] Nick change: arik|food -> arik
[12:28] <thomas> wtay: I just want to start making my plugins more general
[12:28] <ajmitch> wtay: and if you want to do both?
[12:28] <thomas> wtay: ... and I want to start thinking about setting up a good audio test suite
[12:28] <wtay> ajmitch: then you use both branches, like I do :)
[12:28] <thomas> I think the site could do with that, no ?
[12:29] <wtay> yes
[12:29] <thomas> some sample audio files in various formats so that plugins are tested to the full
[12:29] <thomas> wtay: Ok, I'll take HEAD today then...
[12:30] <wtay> maybe even put those files on the site and use gnomevfs htpp:// <g>
[12:30] <thomas> shouldn't be a problem
[12:30] <wtay> there, bonobo-media checked in
[12:31] <wtay> I'm ready :)
[12:32] <thomas> I'll start by downloading first...
[12:32] <wtay> heh
[12:32] <arik> anyway later all
[12:33] arik (arik at sdn-ar-002waseatP320.dialsprint.net) left #gstreamer.
[12:33] <wtay> arik: cya
[12:33] <thomas> wtay: rerun autogen.sh or not ?
[12:33] <wtay> rerun
[12:35] <thomas> all my meters are in the red, I get an Out of memory error, and things go REALLY slow
[12:36] <thomas> I thought the configure problem was fixed ?
[12:36] <wtay> thomas: yu need to patch automake
[12:36] <thomas> wtay: how do I do that ? download a new version ?
[12:36] <wtay> thomas: just take your text editor and apply the patch to /usr/bin/automake as outlined in README
[12:39] sienap (synap at ipc379c0bf.dial.wxs.nl) joined #gstreamer.
[12:39] <sienap> Hi all!
[12:40] <wtay> hi
[12:40] <thomas> hi
[12:40] <sienap> Wtay!
[12:40] <sienap> thomas!
[12:41] Action: sienap gaat weer coden
[12:41] <sienap> :)
[12:41] <sienap> rot sdl wou gister weer eens niet mee werken
[12:41] <sienap> even klappen verkopen aan ding
[12:41] <sienap> maarja ik hebbut gister wel flink gesloopt wat werkte zie ik..
[12:41] <sienap> drinken / coden gaat dus niet samen *G*
[12:41] <thomas> wtay: ok that patch works...
[12:42] <thomas> wtay: do you have any experience with framebuffer devices ?
[12:42] <wtay> nope
[12:43] <sienap> thomas heb jij paranormal al zien
[12:43] <sienap> gezien that is
[12:44] <thomas> sienap: wat is dat, een film ?
[12:44] <sienap> mwha
[12:44] <sienap> xmms plugin
[12:45] <sienap> die we gaan usen voor gstreamer
[12:45] <sienap> die gozer gaatum porten naar gstreamer
[12:45] <sienap> en ik benner ook beetje mee aanut spelen
[12:45] <sienap> plasmaatje inbouwen:)
[12:45] <sienap> maar ik wil dat eerst even in SDL testen
[12:45] <sienap> en dat gaat lief maar niet mee werken
[12:45] <thomas> succes ;)
[12:45] <sienap> *G*
[12:46] <sienap> ik moet een buffer in een keer naar een SDL surface kunnen blaaten
[12:46] <sienap> anders moet ik per pixel locken / unlocken
[12:46] <sienap> eneuhm dat schiet echt niet op :)
[12:47] <sienap> dus redelijk poep
[12:53] <sienap> mwh
[12:53] <sienap> beetje maagpijn
[12:53] <sienap> blerg
[12:53] <sienap> :)
[13:04] Nick change: ajmitch -> ajzzzz
[13:09] <sienap> ehm mwha maybe it isn't working because i am not making an cosintable at all... ;)
[13:14] <sienap> ehm..
[13:14] <sienap> lost the clue..
[13:19] <sienap> YES YESSEYSEYSEYSEYSEY
[13:19] <sienap> it works
[13:19] <sienap> ;)
[13:19] <sienap> a bit
[13:19] <sienap> :)
[13:19] <sienap> *happy*
[13:19] <thomas> congrats
[13:19] Action: thomas is still trying to get exchange to do what I want
[13:22] Action: wtay is converting the pipefilter into a DECOUPLED element
[13:22] <sienap> thomas only i have 1 frame a 30 seconds now
[13:22] <sienap> or something
[13:22] <sienap> :)
[13:22] <sienap> is because i unload / lock the sdl surface every pixel
[13:23] <thomas> or maybe you reversed the division, you should have 30 frames for 1 second ;)
[13:23] <sienap> and my palette isn't making scense either..
[13:23] <sienap> thomas it is just because how i draw my screen
[13:23] <thomas> well, good luck on a 900 x speedup
[13:23] <sienap> but i don't know how to place a screenbuffer into the sdl surface at once
[13:24] <thomas> wtay: my idea would be for now to change passthrough so that it can display what kind of data is flowing through it
[13:24] <thomas> wtay: is that a good way to start ?
[13:25] <wtay> I suppose
[13:25] <wtay> define display?
[13:25] <sienap> think i just intergrate it in parnormal
[13:25] <sienap> then it should work ok
[13:25] <sienap> wtay i've got the thingy working a bit now :)
[13:25] <thomas> wtay: if you set the right option, it just prints it out like other plugins
[13:25] <wtay> cool
[13:25] <sienap> i need something to eat
[13:26] <wtay> thomas: ok
[13:26] <sienap> wtay only the framerate is disasterous low.. the sdl version that is
[13:26] <sienap> it is because i lock/unlock the sdl surface every pixel.. really sucks :(
[13:26] <sienap> the rest is just eaten from an table
[13:26] <wtay> don't do that
[13:27] <sienap> he ?
[13:27] <wtay> lock on every pixel :)
[13:27] <sienap> hehe
[13:27] <sienap> yeah doh
[13:28] <sienap> but i don't know how to paste a whole buffer at once to the screen surface
[13:28] <sienap> :)
[13:28] <sienap> can't figure it out either
[13:28] <sienap> but i am making some breakfast
[13:28] <sienap> brb
[13:40] <thomas> wtay: I created some test files, all named dark.(khz)-(bit depth)-(channels).wav...
[13:40] <thomas> ... where should I put them ?
[13:40] <wtay> thomas: not in CVS IMO
[13:40] <thomas> btw a disksrc ! parsewav ! esdsink pipeline with 8 bit doesn't sound right
[13:41] <thomas> and a 48000 Hz file sounds too slow, so it's being interpreted as 44100 I suppose
[13:41] <wtay> hmm
[13:41] <wtay> ok
[13:41] <thomas> ... and a mono file is doublespeed, so it probably interpretes it as stereo as well
[13:41] <wtay> I would suggest to put it online in gstreamer.net/media/testsuite
[13:41] <thomas> hmm, this isn't good
[13:42] <wtay> and with osssink?
[13:42] <thomas> same thing...
[13:42] <thomas> I'll check my files first with standart utils ;)
[13:42] <wtay> the parsewav is broken
[13:42] <thomas> standard play plays them perfectly
[13:43] <thomas> ok, is parsewav hard to fix ?
[13:43] <wtay> not at all I think
[13:43] <thomas> ok, I'll try that first then
[13:43] <thomas> btw how do i put stuff on the site ?
[13:43] <wtay> scp
[13:43] <thomas> to sourceforge then ?
[13:44] <wtay> scp somefile.wav thomas at shell.sourceforge.net:/home/groups/g/gs/gstreamer/htdocs/media/testsuite
[13:44] <wtay> you might ssh into that dir first to create the testsuite dir
[13:48] <thomas> ok, incoming
[13:49] <wtay> parsewav doesn't even set caps, so that must be fixed
[13:50] <wtay> .. leaving the oss/esdsink in whatever default state they are (44100Hz, stereo, 16 bit)
[13:50] <thomas> wtay: yeah, that's what it sounds like on the output side
[13:51] <thomas> why are some plugins called gst... and others not ?
[13:51] <wtay> depends on the mood of the programmer :)
[13:51] Action: thomas votes mood influences should be banned ;)
[13:52] sienap (synap at ipc379c0bf.dial.wxs.nl) left #gstreamer.
[13:52] <thomas> hmmm, half of the chain code is commented out
[13:52] <wtay> right, that's why it's marked green in the roadmap :)
[13:52] <wtay> s/green/yellow
[13:53] <thomas> ok, so parsewav should just get some data from the first buffer, translate it to caps, and then pass on the next chunks of data right ?
[13:55] <wtay> yes
[13:55] <thomas> ok, i'll start by uncommenting all of the g_print's ;)
[13:56] <wtay> ./gstreamer-launch disksrc location=somefile.ogg ! pipefilter command=gzip ! { disksink location=test.gz }
[13:57] <wtay> yay! gstreamer does gzip!
[13:57] <thomas> nice...
[13:57] <thomas> but why is gzip useful in this case ?
[13:57] <thomas> not to bring you down or anything ;)
[13:57] <thomas> so we can run sox now as well ?
[13:57] <wtay> substitute gzip by sow
[13:57] <wtay> s/sow/sox
[13:57] <thomas> but you probably can't supply params right now ?
[13:58] <wtay> you can
[13:58] <wtay> caps are another matter unfortunalty
[14:00] <thomas> ok, most of the print statements reference code/structs that aren't there anymore
[14:00] <wtay> neat
[14:01] Action: wtay thinks thomas discovered the world of bitrot
[14:02] <thomas> wtay: ;) how many times does this kind of stuff happen ?
[14:02] <wtay> bitrot?
[14:03] <thomas> no, dealing with it...
[14:03] <wtay> thomas: is audio-test.gz a tar/gz?
[14:03] <thomas> yes
[14:03] <thomas> oops, forgot to add tar
[14:03] <thomas> sorry
[14:03] <thomas> fixing that
[14:03] <wtay> I was thinking about a -launch command to get and extract it :)
[14:04] <thomas> would be nice
[14:04] <wtay> where are we going to extract it to?
[14:05] <thomas> hmm, wtay: gcc complains about wavfactory not being used
[14:05] <thomas> I didn't touch that
[14:05] <wtay> I think that's the typedetect stuff
[14:06] <thomas> probably my fault anyway, restarting
[14:07] sienap (synap at ipc379c0bf.dial.wxs.nl) joined #gstreamer.
[14:08] <wtay> ../../tools/gstreamer-launch gnomevfssrc location=http://gstreamer.net/media/testsuite/audio-test.tar.gz ! pipefilter \"command=tar -tvz\" ! { fdsink }
[14:08] <wtay> it works!
[14:09] <sienap> haha cool stuff
[14:09] <wtay> list the contents of a tar.gz file over HTTP using gstreamer...
[14:09] <sienap> man that is just cool
[14:13] <sienap> yeah
[14:13] <sienap> arouns 10 fps now
[14:13] <sienap> can see it actually moving
[14:13] <sienap> *VErry verry happy*
[14:16] <thomas> congrats sienap
[14:17] <sienap> however
[14:17] <sienap> i has to be awy faster
[14:17] <sienap> under dos i can draw it faster then my monitors v_retrace
[14:17] <sienap> and that on a p100
[14:17] <sienap> and this is an p233
[14:19] <thomas> wtay: now I can't even run a parsewav pipeline without a segfault
[14:19] <wtay> oops
[14:19] <thomas> maybe it's my wavs and the way they're decoded
[14:19] <thomas> it's something in the riff detection
[14:22] <thomas> hm... wtay: does your parsewav still work ?
[14:22] <wtay> thomas: sec..
[14:23] <thomas> wtay: gstreamer-register fixed it !
[14:23] <thomas> I thought that shouldn't make a difference ?
[14:24] <wtay> it works here
[14:24] <wtay> thomas: symbols clashes screw things up if you don't register
[14:27] <thomas> wtay: how should plugins output debug data anyway ?
[14:27] <thomas> I mean, through GST_DEBUG, but with what mask ?
[14:27] <sienap> wtay i think i know why my thingy only does 10fps now
[14:27] <sienap> i do an case for color depth every damn pixel
[14:27] <wtay> thomas: I usually use GST_CAT_PLUGIN_INFO
[14:29] <sienap> wtay is case slow ?
[14:30] <wtay> sienap: not really slow, no
[14:30] <sienap> hmm
[14:30] <wtay> you wont gain +20 fps by removing it
[14:31] <thomas> you do if the case is inside the loop for one million pixels a second !
[14:31] <thomas> sienap: can't you just wrap the case around the loop ?
[14:31] <wtay> well, yeah depends 
[14:31] <sienap> thomas i am looking at it
[14:31] <sienap> wtay then what what makes my thingy so slow
[14:31] <sienap> it really has to be more then 10 fps
[14:32] <thomas> did you code it in bash ? ;)
[14:32] <sienap> eh
[14:32] <sienap> :)
[14:32] <sienap> no 
[14:38] <sienap> hehe
[14:38] <sienap> dit is ziek
[14:38] <sienap> ik zit met een sdl gastje te praten
[14:38] <sienap> hij zit me te hepen
[14:38] <sienap> helpen
[14:38] <sienap> blijkte ongeveer 3km van me af te wonen
[14:38] <sienap> :)
[14:39] <thomas> feestje van maken
[14:39] <sienap> mwha
[14:39] <sienap> toch maar niet he ;)
[14:40] <wtay> hmm, iemand ervaring met pipes?
[14:41] <thomas> welke ? named fifo of gewoon ?
[14:41] <wtay> pipe(2)
[14:41] <thomas> nee
[14:42] <sienap> wtay wat wil je pijpen ?
[14:46] <wtay> one thread does a read, another a write. The writing thread knows it's EOF and does a close on the pipe. the reading thread doesn't exit the read call :(
[14:47] Action: wtay makes even more coffee
[14:48] <thomas> wtay: do you check for return value 0 instead of -1 on the read function call ?
[14:48] <wtay> yes
[14:48] <wtay> also -1
[14:48] <thomas> do you use a fork ?
[14:48] <wtay> but then I do perror
[14:48] <wtay> execvp
[14:49] <wtay> and fork
[14:49] <thomas> ok, if you use a fork you have to close the pipe in all of the childs  and the parent
[14:49] <thomas> did you do that ?
[14:49] <wtay> not sure
[14:49] <wtay> I think only the parent
[14:49] <thomas> you should close the write pipe in the child as well
[14:50] <thomas> the actual file is left open if not all of the file descriptors are closed
[14:50] <wtay> but that's the command stdin.
[14:50] <wtay> how can I close that?
[14:50] <thomas> hm, ok you probably can't.
[14:50] <thomas> but why are you doing it like this then ?
[14:50] <thomas> can't you just read from stdin as it is ?
[14:51] <wtay> I copy stdin to the pipe
[14:51] <wtay> dup2
[14:51] sienap (synap at ipc379c0bf.dial.wxs.nl) left #gstreamer.
[14:52] <wtay> maybe I need a select or something to close the pipe in the reader threads context
[14:52] <thomas> wtay: it says here in some book that you *can* close stdin
[14:52] <thomas> you should have your reader thread close the write pipe fd anyway
[14:52] <thomas> and vice versa
[14:52] <thomas> when you fork
[14:53] <wtay> dup2 does that
[14:53] <thomas> ok, and what happens when you try closing the read pipe fd in the read thread ?
[14:54] <wtay> I don't, I close it in the write thread and then I get interupted system call
[14:54] <wtay> btw, I don't have any unix books :)
[14:55] Action: wtay goes on filding some more
[14:55] <wtay> s/filding/fidling
[14:56] <wtay> s/fidling/fiddling
[14:56] Action: wtay does some google queries
[14:57] <thomas> wtay: You can download source code from a book I have on the subject...
[14:57] <thomas> it should explain it well
[14:58] <thomas> would that help ?
[14:58] <wtay> yes
[14:58] <thomas> the site is www.wrox.com
[14:58] <thomas> do a search by author, Neil Mathew
[14:58] <thomas> the book is called beginning linux programming
[14:59] <wtay> No Results Match Your Query :Neil Mathew
[15:00] <wtay> ok, 2 "t"s
[15:00] <thomas> sorry
[15:01] <thomas> then check in chapter 11 when you untar
[15:01] <wtay> cool thx
[15:02] <thomas> the right example is pipe5; it creates a pipe, forks, and then does some stuff
[15:02] <wtay> uhm, I must have taken the wrong book then
[15:02] <thomas> how so ?
[15:03] <wtay> oh chapter 12 :)
[15:03] <thomas> wtay: who wrote parsewav ? I can't figure out what it wants to do or wanted to do at some point...
[15:03] <thomas> wtay: do I just set caps as soon as it detects them ?
[15:03] <wtay> omega
[15:03] <wtay> yes
[15:07] <wtay> thomas: you should subsrcibe to the LAD mailing list and see how they reinvent gstreamer :)
[15:09] <thomas> wtay: can't they be swayed to use gstreamer ?
[15:09] <wtay> thomas: omega tried
[15:09] <wtay> they're very theoritical about their ideas still
[15:10] <thomas> wtay: any good example on how to set caps on the src pad ?
[15:10] <wtay> now they're still in the "one format for audio" stage
[15:10] <wtay> thomas: vorbisdec
[15:10] <thomas> what do you mean, one format ?
[15:10] <thomas> as in compression...
[15:10] <thomas> or as in integer/float ?
[15:10] <wtay> like float for an internal audio format
[15:10] <wtay> it does make sense of course
[15:11] <thomas> yeah, but more so than integer ?
[15:11] <wtay> but then again they are questioning the value of it when the HW only does ints :)
[15:11] <thomas> I've never quite understood the benefit on normal platforms
[15:11] <wtay> you need both
[15:11] <wtay> and more
[15:12] <wtay> it *has* to be optimal for whatever HW you have
[15:12] <thomas> true, but it's hard to optimize for HW these days IMO.
[15:12] <thomas> Though the fact that gstreamer uses regular C helps
[15:12] <wtay> that's why gstreamer will do in place audio effects on the DMA buffers one day
[15:13] <thomas> wtay: ok THAT would be perfect
[15:13] <wtay> the point is that we *can* do it...
[15:13] <wtay> if you're all float internally, you can't
[15:14] <thomas> wtay: but do you think it's a good idea to have both types for each kind of plugin ?
[15:14] <thomas> I mean, there's enough bitrot already
[15:14] <thomas> Some things could do with a little standardizing
[15:14] <thomas> and some sort of docs to make it easier
[15:14] <wtay> two types for what?
[15:14] <thomas> for each plugin...
[15:14] <thomas> the adder and volenv handle int data for example
[15:14] <wtay> media types?
[15:14] <wtay> oh
[15:14] <thomas> and only 16 bit at that for the moment
[15:15] <thomas> do we *need* each plugin to deal with both types ?
[15:15] <wtay> undecided
[15:15] <thomas> or do we use plugins to convert ?
[15:15] <wtay> I tend to think converters are the best option
[15:15] <thomas> wtay: probably depends on how many elements there are in the pipeline
[15:15] <wtay> yes
[15:16] <thomas> it wastes cycles and it lowers quality
[15:16] <wtay> there are tradeoffs to make
[15:16] <thomas> but it's a tough decision
[15:16] <thomas> maybe gstreamer needs some sort of plugin verification system ...
[15:16] <thomas> .. a bit more elaborate than the current roadmap
[15:16] <wtay> yes, I intend to start one soon
[15:16] <thomas> ... to see where each plugin is completed/headed...
[15:16] <thomas> how do other projects do that anyway ?
[15:17] <wtay> arts also has a fixed internal format AFAIK
[15:18] <wtay> anyway adding float types to adder isn't that much work, when we want to optimize things in the future
[15:19] <thomas> no, true
[15:19] <thomas> but some designer doc for audio plugins outlining this would be nice
[15:19] <wtay> yes, indeed
[15:19] <thomas> which maybe I should just take up as I go along
[15:19] <wtay> that would be very helpfull
[15:19] <thomas> who else does audio stuff on gstreamer ?
[15:19] <wtay> and greatly appreciated :-)
[15:19] <wtay> zaheer sorta did
[15:20] <wtay> somebody is going to get the LADSPA plugins i a working state too
[15:20] <wtay> steveb
[15:21] <wtay> most of the programmers are into audio AFAIK
[15:21] <thomas> wtay: the pad handed to gst_parsewav_chain, is that the src pad ?
[15:21] <thomas> I suppose so...
[15:21] <wtay> yes
[15:21] sienap (synap at ipc379c0bf.dial.wxs.nl) joined #gstreamer.
[15:21] <thomas> there is no other anyway ;)
[15:21] <sienap> mom
[15:21] <wtay> doh
[15:21] <sienap> i am puttnig a screenshot online..
[15:22] <wtay> ah
[15:22] <thomas> wtay: vorbisdec sets all of the caps once with gst_pad_set_caps...
[15:22] <thomas> ... can I register just one of them in the same way ?
[15:23] <wtay> thomas: no
[15:23] <thomas> ok, so all of them need to be set at once ?
[15:23] <wtay> well...
[15:23] <wtay> yes
[15:23] <thomas> oh i see, parsewav doesn't even *have* a gst_pad_set_caps
[15:23] <thomas> then it doesn't matter ;)
[15:23] <wtay> alse capsnego will freak out when you set the caps one by one
[15:24] <wtay> [13:49:50] <wtay> parsewav doesn't even set caps, so that must be fixed
[15:26] <sienap> wtay still there ?
[15:26] <sienap> http://www.ipng.nl/snapsshot.png
[15:27] <sienap> a screenshot of the plasma
[15:27] <thomas> wtay: I suppose plugins are forced to register ALL of the caps at once ?
[15:27] <sienap> thomas please look at my screenie :)
[15:28] <thomas> I've seen it, doesn't move ;)
[15:28] <thomas> looks nice though
[15:28] <wtay> thomas: yes
[15:28] <sienap> he doh
[15:28] <sienap> :)
[15:28] <thomas> btw never put your root password on screenshots
[15:28] <sienap> it is too slow
[15:28] <sienap> wtay please look at the url :)
[15:28] <wtay> I did, looks good
[15:30] <sienap> wtay he it hasn't a palette yet
[15:30] <sienap> so it sucks
[15:30] <sienap> but it is too slow
[15:30] <sienap> 25 fps
[15:31] <thomas> wtay: shouldn't parsewav have a template for it's src pad ?
[15:31] <sienap> man this makes me sick
[15:31] <sienap> why only 25 fps
[15:31] <sienap> on my p100 i do faster then my monitor his v_retrace
[15:32] <wtay> thomas: yes :)
[15:37] <wtay> thomas: looks like it's fixed when I close some more fds...
[15:37] <thomas> wtay: good
[15:39] <wtay> yeah, the child thread still had the parents read fd open
[15:39] <thomas> i'll try not to say "i told you so" ;)
[15:39] <wtay> I'll try not to say "I had no clue"
[15:41] <thomas> wtay: is there something like GST_PROPS_INT_LIST ?
[15:44] <wtay> thomas: no, use a GST_PROPS_LIST with ints
[15:44] <wtay> or use a range if possible
[15:44] <wtay> GST_PROPS_INT_LIST could be a nice addition actually...
[15:45] <thomas> ok, parsewav has a default src template now
[15:45] <thomas> but it still doesn't seem to work
[15:46] <wtay> hmm
[15:46] <thomas> i'm flying blind here ;)
[15:46] <wtay> you set the caps on the src pad?
[15:46] <thomas> yes, but how can I test that it works ?
[15:46] <wtay> you created the pad from the template?
[15:47] <wtay> thomas: attach it to osssink and check the output
[15:47] Action: steveb is back
[15:47] <wtay> ih
[15:47] <wtay> err hi
[15:47] <steveb> hi
[15:47] <thomas> wtay: I just added it in parsewav_chain
[15:47] <steveb> haven't read the history yet but i saw my name
[15:47] <thomas> should I create the pad there ?
[15:47] <thomas> I'd think it's already in there
[15:47] <wtay> the pad should be created in _init
[15:48] <wtay> the caps should be set in chain
[15:48] <thomas> ok, I don't think it's created in _init
[15:48] <steveb> omega is currently having a go at ladspa afaik
[15:48] <thomas> I added add_padtemplate
[15:49] <thomas> wtay: how can parsewav work if it doesn't create a pad in it's init ?
[15:49] <wtay> thomas: it *should* create a pad in _init
[15:49] <thomas> ah okay, in gst_parsewav_init
[15:49] <wtay> yes
[15:49] <thomas> but not from a template
[15:49] <thomas> so I should change that I suppose
[15:50] <wtay> yes
[15:50] <wtay> but it's not that important to get it to work in -launch
[15:50] <thomas> why not ?
[15:50] <wtay> the templates are only for autoplugging and element selection
[15:51] <wtay> they serve as a rough indication what this element will do
[15:53] <thomas> wtay: but I should be able to have it detect mono, no ?
[15:53] <wtay> osssink?
[15:53] <thomas> no, parsewav
[15:54] <wtay> yes, but you do that when you parse the wav header
[15:54] <thomas> wtay: yes, I did that, but it doesn't work
[15:54] <thomas> so I did it wrong I suppose
[15:54] <wtay> thomas: can you commit the changes?
[15:55] <thomas> done
[15:55] mattsm (mattsm at adsl-216-62-180-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) left irc: Client Exiting
[15:55] <thomas> wtay: sure it's a good idea to commit code I don't understand yet ? ;)
[15:55] <wtay> HEAD i assume
[15:55] <thomas> yeah
[15:55] <wtay> I'll take a look and explain :)
[15:56] <thomas> how do I get oss output ? I tried osssink mute=FALSE
[15:56] <thomas> no go
[15:56] <wtay> ok, first thing: the template factory can be written with neat macros
[15:56] <wtay> hmm
[15:56] <sienap> ffkes ijs fetchen
[15:57] <wtay> ooooh
[15:57] <wtay> thomas: you set the caps on the sinkpad
[15:57] <thomas> oops
[15:57] <thomas> nice going
[15:57] <thomas> uhm, how so ?
[15:58] <wtay> the chain function has the pad that received the buffer as an arg (the sinkpad)
[15:58] <thomas> so it's the sinkpad that gets passed to the chain function ?
[15:58] <wtay> hmm yeah
[15:58] <thomas> ok, so I need to go up and down the other side ?
[15:58] <wtay> I remember telling you something else
[15:58] <wtay> sorry 
[15:58] <thomas> wtay: I wasn't going to mention that little fact ;)
[15:58] <wtay> so parsewav->srcpad
[15:59] <thomas> ok, now there's a descriptive error
[15:59] <thomas> that should help
[16:00] <wtay> yup, your template lists the signed property but you don't set it
[16:00] <thomas> I got bored ;)
[16:00] <thomas> ok, now it sounds different
[16:01] <thomas> ok, of course, I put it at 8000 to check
[16:01] <thomas> so that works
[16:01] <thomas> yay, mono works !
[16:01] <wtay> does it makes sense
[16:01] <thomas> wtay: yes it did, I set 8000 as samplerate
[16:01] <thomas> sounds like someone burping if you feed it 44100 data ;)
[16:01] <thomas> ok, I'll commit it again
[16:01] <thomas> then put in the rest of the stuff
[16:02] <wtay> ok
[16:02] hadess (hadess at pc2-guil2-0-cust150.gui.cable.ntl.com) joined #gstreamer.
[16:02] <thomas> ok done
[16:02] <thomas> hi hadess
[16:02] <wtay> thomas: examples/plugins/example.c has lots of comments
[16:02] <wtay> hi hadess
[16:02] <hadess> hey thomas
[16:03] <hadess> hello guys
[16:03] <hadess> yo wtay
[16:03] <thomas> wtay: should have looked at that sooner ! ;)
[16:04] <wtay> heh
[16:04] <hadess> thomas: what you're up to ?
[16:04] <thomas> wtay: why don't plugins have version numbers of there own anyway ?
[16:04] <thomas> hadess: I'm strangling parsewav
[16:04] <wtay> thomas: they have...
[16:04] <thomas> hadess: I was *trying* to update my plugins for various audio formats...
[16:04] <thomas> ... so I put some sample audio files online to test with ...
[16:05] <wtay>  ../../tools/gstreamer-launch gnomevfssrc location=/home/wim/audio-test.gz ! pipefilter \"command=tar -tvz\" ! { fdsink }
[16:05] <thomas> ... now I want to change passthrough so that it spits out the type of audio data it's working with 
[16:05] <thomas> wtay: what do I need to install for gnome-vfs to work ?
[16:05] <hadess> thomas: oaf, libxml, glib, gtk iirc
[16:05] <hadess> thomas: and gconf
[16:05] <wtay> thomas: hadess is the author :)
[16:06] <thomas> hadess: nice
[16:06] <hadess> wtay: does it work if the location is on a file:/// ?
[16:06] <hadess> s/on/not
[16:06] <wtay> hadess: also yes
[16:07] <wtay> hadess: I had a more intersting line with http:// before...
[16:07] <hadess> wtay: heh, just showing off i see =)
[16:07] <wtay> hadess: yeah, with your code :)
[16:08] <hadess> i'll need to implement seek with it
[16:08] <thomas> wtay: bit depth and samplerate also seem to work
[16:08] <thomas> wtay: so I guess the basics are done now ?
[16:09] <wtay> ../../tools/gstreamer-launch gnomevfssrc location=http://gstreamer.net/media/testsuite/audio-test.tar.gz ! pipefilter \"command=tar -tvz\" ! { fdsink }
[16:09] <hadess> thomas: do you plan to make a wavesink ?
[16:09] <wtay> thomas: yup
[16:09] <thomas> hadess: not yet.  but that should be easy, come to think of it.
[16:09] <thomas> hadess: do you need one ?
[16:09] <hadess> thomas: i will yes, for the cd-burning part of my app
[16:10] <thomas> wtay: maybe it's a good idea to write a wavesink and explain the creation of it step by step ?
[16:10] <wtay> hadess: how many multimedia frameworks can list the contents of a tar archive over http?
[16:10] <wtay> thomas: good idea
[16:10] <thomas> wtay: how many apps that deal with listing contents of tars over http call themselves "multimedia" ?
[16:10] <hadess> thomas: mpg123 has code for the wavesink, and it would be nice to have a flag for those special audio tracks...
[16:10] <thomas> ;)
[16:11] <wtay> hehehe
[16:11] <hadess> wtay: hehe, this is a powerful multimedia framework :)
[16:11] <thomas> hadess: what do you mean, special ?
[16:11] <thomas> hadess: and how does mpg123 have code for wavesink ?
[16:12] <thomas> hadess: oh you mean the full-blown mpg123
[16:12] <hadess> thomas: yes, it has code to write a .wav file from audio/raw
[16:12] <thomas> wtay: is there actually a server on the other end of the LAD majordomo ?
[16:12] <wtay> hmm, now I need to figure out how to actually extract the contents of the tar.gz and use parsewav ! osssink to play them
[16:12] <thomas> I've sent three sub mails already
[16:13] <hadess> thomas: it also has code to write audio tracks file understandable by cdrecord
[16:13] <thomas> aren't wavs ok already ?
[16:13] <hadess> wtay: i think it should be possible to do that with gnomevfs actually...
[16:13] <hadess> thomas: no, if they are wav, you need to use mkisofs in between
[16:13] <wtay> hadess: you're spoiling the fun :-)
[16:14] <hadess> wtay: something like location=http://gstreamer.net/media/testsuite/audio-test.tar.gz#tgz/file.mp3
[16:14] <wtay> hadess: cool
[16:14] Action: wtay is trying that
[16:15] <thomas> ok, I'm going to get something to eat first
[16:15] Action: thomas is back in a sec
[16:16] <wtay> hadess: doesn't work
[16:17] Nick change: steveb -> steveb-away
[16:18] <wtay> hadess: anywhere I can find the vfs syntax?
[16:18] <hadess> wtay: i'm looking for the exact syntax here
[16:18] <hadess> wtay: the gzip support is crummy right now in gnome-vfs from what i've been told...
[16:19] <wtay> hadess: oh
[16:20] <hadess> try location=http://gstreamer.net/media/testsuite/audio-test.tar.gz#gzip#tar:file.mp3
[16:20] greg_ (greg at home.sente.pl) joined #gstreamer.
[16:22] <wtay> hadess: nope
[16:22] <hadess> dunno then...
[16:23] <sienap> back
[16:24] Uraeus (cschalle at c224s9h5.upc.chello.no) joined #gstreamer.
[16:25] <Uraeus> hi
[16:25] <sienap> uraeus!
[16:25] <hadess> hey Uraeus, how's the boat ?
[16:25] <greg_> hello all ! Just reading gstreamer roadmap... looks *extremly* interesting ;-)
[16:25] <wtay> hi Uraeus
[16:26] <Uraeus> seems we finally discovered the problem, the desiel is bad, so we need to get around 20 liters of diesel out somehow
[16:26] <sienap> greg_ it is :)
[16:28] Action: Uraeus sees the cothreads debate rolls on, and a weird message from Martin about auditing gstreamer compared to ORBit
[16:28] <wtay> hadess: yup, gzip is not working, then I unzip first it works
[16:29] <greg_> will subtitles stuff be separate plugin or just a player feature ?
[16:29] <hadess> wtay: try replacing gzip by gunzip
[16:29] <wtay> hadess: hmm, good point :)
[16:29] <Uraeus> what is the chance of someone placing a virus or something inside a media file and getting GStreamer to activate it?
[16:29] <wtay> hadess: noe
[16:29] <wtay> hadess: nope
[16:30] <thomas> Uraeus: depends on if someone writes a plugin for it...
[16:30] <Uraeus> aaaargh, anyone but me aware that the GStreamer mail archive doesn't work?
[16:31] <thomas> imagine, gstreamer scanning your data on viruses before running a pipe ;)
[16:31] <sienap> uraeus ehm i think the change is zero :)
[16:31] <sienap> or you must write an special virus activition plugin >:)
[16:31] <Uraeus> thomas: hehe a virus plugin ok, but embeding a virus in a .wav file?
[16:31] <sienap> uraeus can't
[16:31] <sienap> or the plugin has some strange buffer overflows
[16:32] <wtay> can happen to anyhting actually
[16:32] <sienap> where a modified .wav file can make use off
[16:32] <thomas> hadess: do we need a wavsink, or do we need wavwrap ! disksink ?
[16:32] <sienap> but that is almost impossible
[16:32] <greg_> you mean activating virus by buffer overflow ?
[16:32] <wtay> thomas: wavencoder
[16:32] <wtay> greg_: yup
[16:32] <hadess> thomas: like wtay says
[16:32] <Uraeus> http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-hackers/2001-May/msg00257.html
[16:33] <wtay> much like the netscape security flaws
[16:33] <thomas> wtay: I think gstreamer really needs some guidelines on how to name plugins
[16:33] <thomas> if you'd call it wavencoder then parsewav should be wavdecoder
[16:33] <sienap> greg_ i mean loading asm into your stack with a buffer overlow
[16:33] <Uraeus> thomas: I added your name to the roadmap to the two plugins you requested
[16:33] <sienap> but man this is so almost impossible
[16:33] <thomas> Uraeus: thanks !
[16:33] <greg_> sienap: got it
[16:33] <sienap> playing wav is not just the plain user input >:)
[16:33] <sienap> greg you know how a buffer overflow works ?
[16:34] <thomas> Uraeus: now I have something to show to my mom ;)
[16:34] <Uraeus> hehe
[16:34] <greg_> sieanp: sure. I am a programmer.
[16:34] <sienap> greg_ eh okie :)
[16:34] <wtay> sienap: it's not that hard 
[16:34] <sienap> wtay mwha i think the stuff rather segfaults with a modified .wav file
[16:34] <wtay> sienap: everytime gstreamer segfaults is a potential security flaw
[16:34] <sienap> or just says. . yeah right wav file huh ? :)
[16:35] <wtay> and it does that quite often doesn't it? :-)
[16:35] <sienap> greg_ i wish there were more programmers that knew how a buffer overflow works.. since they are makign them over over and over
[16:35] <sienap> wtay *G*
[16:35] <wtay> so: moral of the story: never run gstreamer as root
[16:36] <sienap> lol
[16:36] <sienap> get a life :)
[16:36] <Uraeus> wtay: so it is technically possible to make a mp3 for instance which causes gstreamer to segfauilt and formats your disk?
[16:36] Nick change: hadess -> hds-shwer
[16:36] <greg_> sienap: People I write programs for are not interested in it. They want program not to segfault too often. BUT I dont write network programs but database apps.
[16:36] <wtay> Uraeus: as root, yes
[16:37] <thomas> so how is gstreamer going to be the next OS if it can't be root then ;)
[16:37] <wtay> thomas: it'll be a userspace OS :-)
[16:37] <sienap> *G*
[16:37] <Uraeus> wtay: ok, but since we use mostly the same libraries as all other media players out there the chance for this is very slim I guess?
[16:38] <greg_> wtay: not running as root is a half-solution. It may give shell/backdoor with user rights. Then by ellevation of permissoions or glib bugs.... 
[16:38] <wtay> Uraeus: no
[16:38] <wtay> Uraeus: the problem is the data
[16:38] <wtay> say I encode my mp3 in such a way that the decoder segfaults and runs the code (mp3 data) on the stack
[16:40] <wtay> so.. when I stream an mp3 in mozilla, my PC can get compromised
[16:40] <greg_> wtay: yes
[16:41] <wtay> like when you have a buffer overflow in you mail client and I send you a carefully constructed mail
[16:41] <greg_> dont wanna sound like a teacher, but "dont trust the data" is basic rule in security business. :-)
[16:41] <wtay> greg_: yup
[16:42] <wtay> besides, who has done an audit on mpeg2dec?
[16:42] <Uraeus> ok, I have to admit I can't even phantom how you do this, but I would think you have to be quite the hacker do be able to pull of suck a trick?
[16:42] <wtay> Uraeus: yes
[16:44] <Uraeus> wtay: do GStreamer add additional risk of exploits of this kind than already present in the libraries we use?
[16:44] <wtay> Uraeus: actually there are quite a few techniques to help you in finding explaoits
[16:44] <wtay> Uraeus: every code that is added increases the risk
[16:45] <Uraeus> wtay: so the conclusion is we should do a security audit?
[16:45] <wtay> Uraeus: If you're paranoid, yes
[16:45] <wtay> especially if you make things network enabled
[16:45] <thomas> Uraeus: I think the conclusion is that before we even begin to audit gstreamer, we might first want to keep it from segfaulting when you don't find a plugin
[16:46] <thomas> ;)
[16:46] <greg_> Uraeus: you should do security audit if you want your software to be treated seriously.
[16:46] <thomas> wtay: is gnome even going to accept gstreamer as long as it does stuff like that ?
[16:46] <wtay> but then again, auditing a thing like gstreamer is next to impossible
[16:46] <sienap> he seriously ? why that :) gstreamer was supposed as a joke wasn't it ? :)
[16:46] <wtay> thomas: nope
[16:47] <greg_> Uraeus: not finding a plugin is not a problem. Problem is when segfaulting impulse comes from the outside.
[16:47] <sienap> when segfaultnig impulse comes from outside it actually mostly means you where fucking up your stack
[16:48] <sienap> and when you can fuck your stack you can take some pointers in hand as well
[16:48] <wtay> greg_: it will when we allow gstreamer construct a pipeline based on XML comming from the outside
[16:48] <sienap> and with pointers in hand you rule >:)
[16:48] <Uraeus> ok, so just making GStreamer stable as hell could be seen as a lightweight security audit then?
[16:48] <thomas> wtay: is any of all this cool stuff going to work a year from now ? ;)
[16:49] <wtay> thomas: the segfault is not gstreamer fault, but the app that doesn't show a dialog or something
[16:49] <sienap> uraeus make sure that impulse from outside can't segfault the stuff means it is also pretty secure yes..
[16:49] <thomas> wtay: yeah, but gstreamer-launch isn't setting a good example
[16:49] <sienap> since the buffers are pretty save then
[16:49] <wtay> thomas: hehe, yeah, we need to fix that :)
[16:50] <thomas> wtay: actually, what am I waiting for ?
[16:50] <wtay> sienap: it's a first step
[16:50] <thomas> I should be able to do that right
[16:50] <greg_> gotta go. see ya
[16:50] <wtay> thomas: that's the spirit :)
[16:50] <wtay> cya
[16:50] <thomas> wtay: I didn't know launch was a bash script ;)
[16:51] <thomas> should I fix it there or in the function src ?
[16:51] <wtay> thomas: hmm, it isn't
[16:51] Nick change: hds-shwer -> hadess
[16:52] <wtay> thomas: the code is in gst/gstparse.c
[16:52] <thomas> wtay: there's an exit(-1) commented out, so it was there already
[16:52] <thomas> so is there a  good reason to comment it out ?
[16:52] <wtay> no
[16:52] dobey (dobey at ip171.bedford16.ma.pub-ip.psi.net) joined #gstreamer.
[16:52] <hadess> thomas: gst-launch is not a bash script, this libtool script to launch gst-launch...
[16:52] <hadess> hey dobey
[16:53] <dobey> hi :-/
[16:53] <wtay> hi dobey
[16:53] <thomas> hadess: right. ok, thanks.
[16:53] <wtay> Uraeus: you can colour pipefilter green :)
[16:53] <thomas> I don't understand what libtool is anyway at the moment
[16:53] <sienap> wtay yes..
[16:53] <Uraeus> wtay: ok, should I add a new column called 'audited' to the roadmap too? :)
[16:54] <wtay> Uraeus: do you know how to audit stuff?
[16:54] <wtay> it takes a few years to do it right
[16:54] <Uraeus> wtay: weeeell, I can crash test the apps :)
[16:54] <wtay> Uraeus: that's a good start
[16:55] <wtay> is somebody doing "\ " handling in gstparse.c?
[16:55] greg_ (greg at home.sente.pl) left irc: [x]chat
[16:57] <hadess> Uraeus: did you add paranormal to the list ?
[16:57] <Uraeus> hadess: yes
[16:57] <Uraeus> wtay: pipefilter was already green, but have you remade it as a decoupled element?
[16:57] <hadess> Uraeus: it's not an application, but a plugin
[16:58] <wtay> Uraeus: yes
[16:58] <Uraeus> hadess: ok, I will move it
[16:58] <sienap> takes a brake before he goes playing further with the plasma
[16:59] <thomas> wtay: is parsewav allowed to go green as well ?
[16:59] <wtay> thomas: if you say so, yes :-)
[16:59] <sienap> ARGH BUIKPIJN
[16:59] <sienap> brb
[16:59] <sienap> he over
[17:00] <sienap> :)
[17:00] <wtay> brb
[17:00] <sienap> wtay but i think buffer flows are the biggest risk huh ?
[17:00] <sienap> thinks like page formating isn't really going up with gstreamer :)
[17:01] <sienap> or am i wrong ?
[17:04] <Uraeus> wtay, hadess: your roadmap fixes are in
[17:04] <thomas> Uraeus: you can change parsewav to green as well if you want
[17:04] <Uraeus> thomas: ok, great
[17:05] <Uraeus> thomas: should I put you as parsewav maintainer?
[17:06] <thomas> Uraeus: I only added a few lines...
[17:06] <thomas> so the honour still goes to Erik afaic
[17:06] <Uraeus> thomas: well, it is currently listed on wtay, and I think he is happy for any plugins taken of his back
[17:06] <thomas> Uraeus: ok, then I'll give it a shot for now
[17:07] <thomas> Uraeus: but I don't understand all of it yet
[17:07] <sienap> wtay when my plasma works i will start making an fire effect as well :)
[17:09] iGN_ (ign at login1.simplemente.net) left irc: Ping timeout for iGN_[login1.simplemente.net]
[17:10] iGN_ (ign at login1.simplemente.net) joined #gstreamer.
[17:11] <sienap> hahaha my plasma is way slow at 800x600 :) but ehm i can actually resize it now
[17:11] <sienap> =]
[17:12] <sienap> now i need something that can skip  frames
[17:12] <sienap> so it has some kind of QoS :)
[17:12] <sienap> but first man i have to leak
[17:12] <sienap> brb :)
[17:12] <thomas> sienap: well that explains your stomach ache ;)
[17:21] Nick change: Uraeus -> Ura_food
[17:23] <wtay> back
[17:23] <sienap> ah
[17:23] <sienap> :)
[17:23] <sienap> hej wtay :)
[17:23] <dobey> yo quiero tequila
[17:23] <thomas> uraeus: if the passthrough plugin is in the roadmap, you can add me to it as well
[17:24] <sienap> dobey i made something relative cool today ;)
[17:24] <thomas> wtay: should a passthrough filter propagate sink caps to src caps manually ?
[17:25] <sienap> http://www.ipng.nl/snapsshot.png
[17:25] <dobey> eh
[17:26] <wtay> oooh, ladspa people found out that floats are overkill for playing a wav
[17:26] <wtay> thomas: it should proxy and then this happens automatically
[17:27] <dobey> that screen didn't cheer me up any :-/
[17:28] <sienap> dobey you don't like my sdl test thingy / :)
[17:29] <dobey> it's ok i guess, i'm just not in the mood
[17:29] <sienap> dobey how come so ?
[17:29] <dobey> 20 < 21
[17:29] <dobey> america sucks
[17:30] <thomas> dobey: drinking sucks too anyway
[17:30] <dobey> no
[17:30] <dobey> being the only sober person within 5 miles sucks
[17:30] <sienap> he
[17:30] <sienap> having a good drink is fun now and then thomas
[17:31] <sienap> isn't it wtay ? :)
[17:31] <sienap> i was way drunk yesterday *DAMN*
[17:31] <wtay> yeah
[17:31] <sienap> had some real indepth strange discusions with kenneth
[17:31] <sienap> who was drunk as well
[17:31] <thomas> sienap: you're not helping dobey that way ;)
[17:31] <wtay> although I don't drink a lot
[17:31] <dobey> spare me
[17:31] <sienap> sadly the discusion wasn't about happy things :(
[17:31] <sienap> wtay as i said now and then :)
[17:31] <thomas> anyway I don't drink a lot either
[17:32] <sienap> me either but now and then just *good* :)
[17:32] <sienap> dobey america has soem strange laws.. car / gun at 16 fucking at 18 and beer at 21... it can be me but don't they just have a little inverted order with those laws ?
[17:33] <dobey> uh
[17:33] <dobey> no
[17:33] <dobey> gun at 18
[17:33] <sienap> NO ?
[17:33] <sienap> ooh
[17:33] <sienap> gun at 18
[17:33] <sienap> however
[17:33] <dobey> and tobacco
[17:33] <sienap> still inverted row
[17:33] <sienap> i mean come an
[17:33] <sienap> :)
[17:33] <thomas> sienap: people can fly an airplane before they can drive a car over here as well
[17:33] <dobey> sienap: please don't make me any more depressed than i already am
[17:33] <sienap> thomas but that is just way cool :)
[17:33] <sienap> dobey he oh sorry was just talking about the laws there
[17:34] <dobey> sadly enough, i'm well aware of them
[17:34] <wtay> so dobey, is it your birthday today?
[17:34] <sienap> he
[17:34] <sienap> ok
[17:34] <sienap> then let others buy you a drink
[17:34] <dobey> i fucking wish
[17:34] <sienap> that is what i did here when i was 14 :)
[17:34] <sienap> and 15
[17:35] <sienap> however when you are depressed anyway drinking won't solve much
[17:35] <wtay> ah sienap you're older than 15? <g>
[17:35] Action: wtay ducks
[17:35] <sienap> wtay he <belgium doesn't excist anyway> :)
[17:37] Action: wtay wants to live in Norway or Sweden or Finland
[17:37] Action: dobey wants to live elsewhere
[17:37] <sienap> wtay you really should explain that..
[17:37] <dobey> in an elysian state, as a floating blue falme
[17:37] <sienap> what is wrong with belgium ?
[17:37] <sienap> :)
[17:37] <sienap> is going to think about a frame skipping thingy..
[17:37] <wtay> too crowded
[17:38] <sienap> wtay he man :)
[17:38] <sienap> hmm but what if the $somedude computere is too slow ;)
[17:38] <sienap> he damn
[17:38] <sienap> have to think about that
[17:38] <sienap> but ehm first a frame skippah ;)
[17:40] <dobey> sienap: http://primates.ximian.com/~dobey/desktop.png
[17:41] <sienap> aah damn the speed problem is at the buffer drawer
[17:41] <sienap> not at the screen drawer
[17:41] <sienap> hmm
[17:41] <sienap> bla
[17:41] <thomas> wtay: when passthrough gets mono data in, it fails with "Could not get caps of pad !"
[17:41] <thomas> I can't find what's causing the caps not being gotten in   caps = GST_PAD_CAPS(pad);
[17:42] <wtay> thomas: how did you do that?
[17:42] <thomas> do what ?
[17:42] <sienap> looks cool dobey..
[17:42] <sienap> dobey but my screenshot wasn't about my desktop but about my plasma thingy
[17:42] <dobey> i know
[17:42] <wtay> thomas: what is the pipeline you use
[17:43] <thomas> tools/gstreamer-launch disksrc location=/tmp/dark.441-16-m.wav ! parsewav ! passthrough ! osssink
[17:43] <thomas> dobey: since you need one ...
[17:43] Action: thomas hugs dobey
[17:43] <thomas> sorry I'm not female
[17:44] <thomas> wtay: I'll commit passthrough first
[17:44] <dobey> thomas: nethugs are not helpful
[17:44] <wtay> thomas: ok
[17:45] <thomas> gstreamer needs a networked hug function ;)
[17:45] <thomas> wtay: it's in
[17:45] <wtay> ok sec..
[17:46] <dobey> thomas: www.fufme.com?
[17:46] <thomas> dobey: haven't got one yet ;)
[17:46] <thomas> have been thinking about it for a long time
[17:46] <wtay> thomas: I know what's wrong
[17:46] <thomas> I wasn't going to mention it ;)
[17:46] <wtay> soo....
[17:46] <thomas> wtay: please share
[17:46] <wtay> thomas: lemme explain it
[17:47] <wtay> thomas: you have a padtemplate, right?
[17:47] <thomas> I think so ;)
[17:47] <wtay> this means that the pad created from this template only accepts the type mentioned in it
[17:47] <wtay> looks what it says about the channels?
[17:47] <wtay> s/looks/look
[17:47] <thomas> wtay: oh, ok...
[17:47] Action: thomas hides
[17:48] <wtay> :)
[17:48] <wtay> I know... we should give a big warning when capsnego fails...
[17:50] <thomas> wtay: ok, now passthrough works as well
[17:50] <thomas> wtay: that should help in testing
[17:51] <wtay> cool
[17:53] <sienap> wtay about security btw
[17:53] <sienap> what about checking every contributed code >:)
[17:54] <wtay> sienap: he man, I still want to have a life too :)
[17:56] <thomas> wtay: ok, what did you think was missing in the caps handling of volenv and adder ?
[17:56] <wtay> thomas: the channels stuff is a bit weird
[17:57] <sienap> wtay you haven't one
[17:57] <sienap> so it is non sense claiming you have 1 :)
[17:58] <thomas> wtay: I don't remember where I copied that from...
[17:58] <thomas> wtay: you mean in the template factory, right ?
[17:58] <wtay> hmm, I gotta eat
[17:59] <wtay> thomas: yes
[17:59] Nick change: wtay -> wtay-eating
[17:59] <dobey> i would eat, but i have no food, and i don't feel like going to get any
[18:03] ajzzzz (ajmitch at p51-max6.dun.ihug.co.nz) left irc: Ping timeout for ajzzzz[p51-max6.dun.ihug.co.nz]
[18:11] <sienap> he cool i think i can get my plasma lighting up on music :)
[18:16] <hadess> haha, added splash screen to my app :P
[18:17] ajzzzz (ajmitch at p51-max6.dun.ihug.co.nz) joined #gstreamer.
[18:18] <sienap> hadess put the splash image online :)
[18:18] <sienap> hadess i am codnig at parormal btw ;)
[18:18] <sienap> doing something usefull at the end >:)
[18:18] <sienap> i am not stuffing my plasma effect
[18:18] <hadess> sienap: that the evo splash screen right now
[18:18] <sienap> but i want to make it more dynamic..
[18:19] <sienap> http://www.ipng.nl/snapsshot.png here for what i have so far
[18:19] <sienap> actually i have more now
[18:19] <sienap> but ehm :)
[18:19] <sienap> it is resizeble as well right now
[18:20] <sienap> *having fun* :)
[18:20] <sienap> man i need to learn my tests as well
[18:20] <sienap> tomorrow burn effeect and then test learning week
[18:20] <sienap> or something
[18:21] <sienap> hadess did you look at my screenshot ?
[18:21] <hadess> it's the same as half an hour ago
[18:21] <sienap> ooh you had a look an half hour ago :)
[18:22] <sienap> but it is a start huh ? :
[18:22] <sienap> :)
[18:22] <hadess> yeah
[18:22] <sienap> *G*
[18:22] <sienap> this is fun stuff
[18:24] <sienap> i am now trying to make the table as dynamic as possible
[18:25] <sienap> so i don't have to re render it when i do some cool changes
[18:25] <sienap> :)
[18:27] <thomas> I'm going home...
[18:27] <thomas> bye all
[18:27] <sienap> bye
[18:28] thomas (thomas at 212-100-172-175.adsl.easynet.be) left irc: [x]chat
[18:47] dobey (dobey at ip171.bedford16.ma.pub-ip.psi.net) left #gstreamer (blah).
[19:07] Nick change: wtay-eating -> wtay
[19:07] <sienap> wtay
[19:07] <sienap> !
[19:07] <sienap> that was a pretty long dinne r:)
[19:11] <wtay> sienap: as usual :)
[19:11] <sienap> hehe
[19:11] <sienap> i hope you didn't do some other naughty kitchen tricks with maYam that took that much time >:)
[19:12] <sienap> talking about maYam , where is she lately ?
[19:12] <wtay> next to me
[19:12] <wtay> watching TV
[19:12] <sienap> *waves*
[19:12] <sienap> :)
[19:12] <sienap> he
[19:12] <sienap> TV juck
[19:12] <sienap> :)
[19:12] <wtay> news, you know...
[19:13] <sienap> aah
[19:13] <sienap> *the modificated what happened in the world program* :)
[19:14] <wtay> yup
[19:14] <sienap> however :)
[19:14] <sienap> hmm hoe zeg je "shoarma" in het engels hej ?
[19:14] <wtay> same
[19:14] <sienap> dat ik ga zo namelijk eens behoorlijk hard naar binnen werken >:)
[19:15] <sienap> he
[19:15] <sienap> why no one knows what shoarma is then ?
[19:16] <sienap> what are you doing wtay ?
[19:16] <sienap> man *fustrated* why is sdl slow ? :)
[19:17] <sienap> he i stop with trying to speed it up
[19:17] <sienap> or actually it is X that is slow
[19:17] <sienap> however
[19:17] <wtay> I know what shoarma is
[19:18] <wtay> and X is not as slow as you think
[19:18] <sienap> ehm yeah
[19:18] <sienap> dog
[19:18] <sienap> doh
[19:18] <sienap> :)
[19:18] <sienap> forget it
[19:18] <sienap> what are u doing ?
[19:18] <wtay> trying to fix -launch so that we can use spaces as args
[19:18] <wtay> s/as/in
[19:19] <sienap> he
[19:19] <sienap> okie
[19:20] <sienap> i need the parnormal author to help me putting the plasma into his thingy
[19:24] <sienap> wtay btw do you think that outputting parnormal data to the videosink is possible (seen speed)
[19:28] <wtay> sure
[19:29] <wtay> it's designed to be fast
[19:31] <sienap> great stufff
[19:31] thomas (thomas at adsl-64064.turboline.skynet.be) joined #gstreamer.
[19:31] <sienap> :)
[19:31] <sienap> then the plugin is going to eb mothafuckinggggg way cooooooooool :)
[19:31] <sienap> *shoarma*
[19:32] <sienap> hmmm that smell *NJUMMIE*
[19:33] <sienap> damn
[19:33] <sienap> deze shoarma lekkah lekkah zjin >:)
[19:39] <wtay> thomas: wb
[19:44] <hadess> wtay: when you have something, lemme know
[19:44] <wtay> hadess: ?
[19:45] <hadess> wtay: for the space problem
[19:45] <wtay> hadess: hehe, sure
[19:48] greg_ (greg at home.sente.pl) joined #gstreamer.
[19:51] <sienap> greg_!!!
[19:52] <greg_> hello ! Didn't want to disturb you ;-) just listening...
[19:55] <thomas> wtay: wb = welcome back ?
[19:58] <wtay> thomas: yup
[19:59] greg_ (greg at home.sente.pl) left irc: Ping timeout for greg_[home.sente.pl]
[19:59] <sienap> lol
[19:59] <sienap> ehm yes
[20:02] <thomas> wtay: when I commit passhtrough it returns M...
[20:02] <thomas> how can I check changes and adapt accordingly ?
[20:02] <wtay> cvs status passthrough.c shows the version number
[20:03] <wtay> cvs diff -r xxx passthrough.c shows the diff
[20:03] jerwin (jeremy at 66-44-69-103.s357.tnt8.lnhva.md.dialup.rcn.com) joined #gstreamer.
[20:03] greg_ (greg at home.sente.pl) joined #gstreamer.
[20:03] <sienap> greg!
[20:03] <sienap> jerwin!
[20:04] <thomas> wtay: ok, so why would it fail to commit ? What's the standard reason ?
[20:04] <wtay> thomas: maybe it's not up to data with the cvs version and you need to do cvs update first
[20:05] <thomas> hmm... now it worked.  must have mistyped something
[20:06] <thomas> wtay: ok, so now volenv and passthrough seem to take caps into account
[20:06] <thomas> now for adder
[20:08] <thomas> wtay: how do you set the version number for the plugin ?
[20:08] <sienap> where is this paranormal dude :(
[20:09] <wtay> thomas: in the details struct
[20:09] <wtay> it currently is the VERSION of the build dir
[20:09] <thomas> wtay: yeah, so all plugins have the same version number as gstreamer now, right ?
[20:09] <wtay> yup
[20:10] <thomas> so plugins don't have one of their own, do they ?
[20:10] <wtay> not yet, no
[20:10] <wtay> it doesn't make sense as long as they are in the main gstreamer dir IMO
[20:11] <thomas> how so ? plugins can have a life of their own, no ?
[20:11] <wtay> when they are in a separate package, yes
[20:11] <wtay> anyway, you can substitute VERSION with a string of your own if you want
[20:12] <thomas> well, it would make more sense wouldn't it ? You should be able to tell if parsewav is a new version...
[20:12] <thomas> or are you only planning on releasing gstreamer with finished plugins
[20:12] <thomas> that do what they should do ?
[20:12] <sienap> think that is the best anyway
[20:12] <thomas> sienap: well good luck then
[20:12] <sienap> releasing ready out of the box software >:)
[20:12] <wtay> sienap: dream on
[20:13] <wtay> :)
[20:13] shitowax (yann at Mix-Annecy-101-2-75.abo.wanadoo.fr) joined #gstreamer.
[20:13] <wtay> yo
[20:13] <shitowax> yo
[20:13] <shitowax> got something for you
[20:13] <shitowax> http://openquicktime.sourceforge.net/gstquicktime.tgz
[20:13] <sienap> wtay he :)
[20:13] <wtay> wooowoow
[20:13] <sienap> shitowax!
[20:13] <sienap> woow
[20:13] <sienap> you mean
[20:13] <sienap> quicktime
[20:13] <sienap> ehm
[20:14] <sienap> working ?
[20:14] <sienap> just WORKING ?
[20:14] <wtay> cool
[20:14] <shitowax> it's only the beginning ...
[20:14] <sienap> *WOOW*
[20:14] <shitowax> only the video for the moment
[20:14] <sienap> you are one of the 3ivx crew ?
[20:14] <shitowax> yep
[20:14] <wtay> WOOWOOW a 3ivx codec!!!
[20:14] Action: wtay jumps around in the room
[20:15] <greg_> may I ask how is 3ivx licenced anyway ? some url ?
[20:15] <shitowax> only a decoding one for the moment
[20:15] <wtay> cool man
[20:15] <shitowax> just a test one
[20:15] <sienap> wtay i think it is time for a drink now >:)
[20:15] <sienap> shitowax man you are way too subtile :)
[20:16] <shitowax> could you please test this stuff ?
[20:16] <sienap> tar: Archive contains future timestamp 2001-05-21 02:03:23
[20:16] <sienap> *G*
[20:16] <wtay> shitowax: doing that right now
[20:16] <shitowax> and take a look at the readme, got lot's of problem ...
[20:17] <wtay> shitowax: be sure to share with what you like/dislike/would like to see changed etc wrt gstreamer
[20:17] <wtay> yup, reading it too
[20:17] <sienap> shitowax so this is full qt support ?
[20:18] <shitowax> no, only video and codec are harcoded, currently only 3ivx is supported
[20:18] <wtay> shitowax: how would you like to see the 3ivx codec being distributed?
[20:19] <wtay> btw shitowax uses Mandrake 8.0 :)
[20:19] <shitowax> I cannot say it now, probably a link on 3ivx.com
[20:19] <thomas> Oh, so it's Mandrake in control of part of the irc naming then ;)
[20:19] Action: thomas ducks and runs
[20:19] <sienap> shitowax the openquicktime library can read from additional gstreamer sources as well ?
[20:19] <sienap> like httpsrc / gnome-vfssrc etc etc ?
[20:19] <wtay> shitowax: can I upload it to gstreamer.net for now? in a private dir
[20:19] <wtay> sienap: of course
[20:20] <sienap> how cool
[20:20] <sienap> :)
[20:20] <sienap> so quicktime is no longer a fairytail  ? :)
[20:20] <shitowax> httpsrc need to be tested but it should be doable
[20:20] <shitowax> I don't want this package to be everywhere, it's only a test one
[20:21] <wtay> shitowax: ok, only on my disk then <g>
[20:21] <sienap> and mine :)
[20:21] <sienap> >:)
[20:21] <sienap> shitowax i think we can thank you for this great stuff :)
[20:21] <shitowax> Have you already tested it ?
[20:22] <sienap> shitowax my install is too broken
[20:22] <sienap> ask wtay
[20:22] <sienap> :)
[20:22] <wtay> shitowax: I'm commiting the stuff now
[20:23] <wtay> shitowax: yann at 3ivx.com?
[20:23] <hadess> hey shitowax
[20:23] <shitowax> hi hadess
[20:23] <shitowax> yep my name is yann
[20:24] <wtay> so, how do we build this thing...
[20:24] <wtay> openquicktime is apt-gettable?
[20:24] <shitowax> sorry only CVS for the moment
[20:24] <sienap> shitowax btw the extension .qt is also quicktime huh ?
[20:25] <shitowax> could be ... 
[20:25] <wtay> ok
[20:25] <hadess> sienap: could you come down please, it's getting annoying
[20:25] <sienap> hadess ?
[20:25] <sienap> hadess i am just asking something dude..
[20:26] <wtay> great, sf is down... nice timing :(
[20:26] <sienap> *G*
[20:26] <wtay> hmm, no it isn't its just an https URL...
[20:30] <wtay> ok, got OpenQuicktime compiled
[20:31] <shitowax> cool ... wihtout any modification ?
[20:31] <wtay> yes
[20:32] <jerwin> what codecs does it support?
[20:32] <wtay> now I'm patching the decoder for the CVS version
[20:32] <shitowax> only 3ivx for the moment ...
[20:33] <sienap>  3ivx has its own quicktime codec ?
[20:34] <shitowax> 3ivx is a quicktime codec
[20:35] <sienap> ah i understand
[20:36] <sienap> so 3ivx did leave .avi ?
[20:36] <shitowax> we never support .avi file format ...
[20:36] <sienap> he *confused* just ignoer me..
[20:36] <sienap> ignore maybe
[20:37] <shitowax> 3ivx is not DivX
[20:38] <sienap> same orgin or am i wrong ?
[20:38] <shitowax> you're wrong, 3ivx is build from scratch
[20:39] <sienap> *ouch* same authors i hope ?
[20:39] <sienap> else i am ashamed of my wrongness >:)
[20:39] <shitowax> We've got the author of the divx player for Mac in our team
[20:40] <sienap> aah .. ok i am ashamed.. :)
[20:40] <sienap> *sorry for his clue less ness*
[20:40] <wtay> sienap: DivX and AVI are all M$ versions of another standard
[20:41] <sienap> wtay DivX is from MS ?? *WTF*
[20:41] <wtay> MPEG4 has choosen QT to be its format IIRC
[20:41] <sienap> aah ic
[20:41] <shitowax> Divx is only a hack of ms-mpeg4v2
[20:42] <sienap> yeah i got my self that far..
[20:42] <sienap> but 3ivx is not related to that at all ?
[20:42] <shitowax> no, 3ivx is 100% legal
[20:43] <sienap> hehe :) 
[20:43] <sienap> *G*
[20:43] <sienap> nice
[20:43] <sienap> also better "?
[20:43] <sienap> ?
[20:43] <shitowax> could be ;)
[20:43] <sienap> he :) all trust in it
[20:43] <sienap> great it is that you guys made an codec for gstreamer :)
[20:44] Action: sienap wishes the paranormal author was online.. i can't get this done my self..
[20:44] <greg_> how about openmpeg - have they started coding yet ???
[20:45] <sienap> *going outside for an short walk* .. nice weather and stuff
[20:45] <sienap> ttyl all
[20:45] <greg_> 3ivx looks 100% commercial, as opposed to openmpeg. Tell me if I am wrong.
[20:46] <shitowax> we've got commercial and free versions
[20:47] <shitowax> but our quicktime plugin is LGPL
[20:47] <greg_> shitowax: just've looked thru licences. I understand commercial, but my heart is on the side of free soft. ;-)
[20:48] <wtay> gstquicktimedecoder.c: In function `quicktime_open_pad':
[20:48] <greg_> shitowax: LGPL ? nice ;-)
[20:48] <wtay> gstquicktimedecoder.c:489: warning: implicit declaration of function `quicktime_init'
[20:48] <wtay> gcc: -lopenquicktime: linker input file unused since linking not done
[20:48] <sienap> shitowax so what part is commercial ?
[20:48] <greg_> sienap: you supposed to be outside ? ;-)
[20:48] <sienap> hehehe
[20:49] <sienap> :)
[20:49] <sienap> one minute
[20:49] <sienap> need to fix something
[20:49] <greg_> shitowax: it is LGPL beacause it was created using LGPL code as a base - isn't it ?
[20:50] <shitowax> yep, that's it, we have hardly hacked QT4L
[20:51] <greg_> does the "testing" versions have limited functionality or sth ? time limited ?
[20:51] <shitowax> just decoding
[20:52] <greg_> shitowax: and no legal using time limit ? that's very nice. OK
[20:52] <sienap> greg_ lgpl
[20:52] <shitowax> we plan to release a free 3ivx encoding plugin as well
[20:53] <sienap> shitowax and the less free one ? what is up with that..
[20:54] <shitowax> you've got a real profesionnal tool
[20:54] <greg_> shitowax: great. excuse me for previosu questions. I admire you for what you do anyway.
[20:55] <shitowax> ;)
[21:00] <greg_> shitowax: but you remmember there is some userfriendly frontend needed too ? codec is not enough.
[21:02] <shitowax> it's only the beginning ;)
[21:04] <shitowax> we've got also a flaskmpeg plugin comming soon ...
[21:05] <sienap> flaskmpeg ?
[21:05] <sienap> for gstreamer that is
[21:05] <sienap> *G*
[21:05] <sienap> :)
[21:05] <greg_> shitowax: may i ask what is flaskmpeg ?
[21:05] <sienap> you guys are pretty great
[21:05] jerwin (jeremy at 66-44-69-103.s357.tnt8.lnhva.md.dialup.rcn.com) left irc: Ping timeout for jerwin[66-44-69-103.s357.tnt8.lnhva.md.dialup.rcn.com]
[21:05] jerwin (jeremy at 66-44-67-147.s401.tnt7.lnhva.md.dialup.rcn.com) joined #gstreamer.
[21:05] <shitowax> a windows tools ... www.flaskmpeg.net or something ...
[21:06] <sienap> so you guys are making an flaskmpeg plugin for gstreamer as well ?
[21:06] <shitowax> no =)
[21:06] <sienap> aah
[21:06] <sienap> damn :(
[21:07] <shitowax> but there will be a 3ivx plugin for flask
[21:07] <sienap> brb
[21:07] sienap (synap at ipc379c0bf.dial.wxs.nl) left irc: sienap has no reason
[21:07] <jerwin> are there any docs on creating plugins?
[21:09] sienap (synap at ipc379c226.dial.wxs.nl) joined #gstreamer.
[21:09] <sienap> backkkk
[21:09] <wtay> sienap: flaskmpeg is an app, for windows
[21:10] <jerwin> what's flaskmpeg do?
[21:10] <wtay> transcoding 
[21:10] <shitowax> convert mpeg-2 into any avi codec
[21:10] <wtay> MPEG2->DivX etc...
[21:11] <jerwin> so it should be easy to write a gstreamer app.
[21:11] <wtay> shitowax: the 3ivx codec outputs YUV?
[21:11] <greg_> uhu - been reading flask page - there should be "what is flaskmpeg" webpage ;-)
[21:11] <shitowax> YUV420P yep
[21:11] <sienap> wtay aah ic
[21:12] <wtay> great, then we'll have Xv too :)
[21:15] <sienap> wtay how much faster Xv actually is ?
[21:15] <wtay> much faster :)
[21:15] <sienap> aah 
[21:15] <sienap> :)
[21:15] <sienap> wtay btw look in query please..
[21:18] Nick change: steveb-away -> steveb
[21:19] <steveb> does anyone know whether a gtk class init function will only ever be run once in a program?
[21:20] <sienap> gone
[21:20] sienap (synap at ipc379c226.dial.wxs.nl) left irc: sienap has no reason
[21:21] jerwin (jeremy at 66-44-67-147.s401.tnt7.lnhva.md.dialup.rcn.com) left irc: [x]chat
[21:29] greg_ (greg at home.sente.pl) left irc: [x]chat
[21:33] <wtay> steveb: only once
[21:41] <steveb> good
[21:44] thomas (thomas at adsl-64064.turboline.skynet.be) left irc: Read error to thomas[adsl-64064.turboline.skynet.be]: Connection reset by peer
[21:50] omega_ (omega at omegacs.net) joined #gstreamer.
[21:52] <wtay> hi
[21:52] <omega_> yo
[21:52] <omega_> I leave again in 20min
[21:52] <wtay> omega_: we have a quicktime and 3ivx plugin
[21:52] <omega_> ooooh
[21:53] <steveb> yo
[21:53] <wtay> and it works
[21:53] <steveb> wtay: is it going in CVS?
[21:53] <wtay> I adapted the qt for CVS but I obviously can't do that with the 3ivx one
[21:54] <wtay> steveb: it's in CVS now
[21:54] Nick change: ajzzzz -> ajmitch
[21:55] <omega_> The entry points of ORBit were already audited. That is why vendors ship ORBit
[21:55] <omega_> with networking disabled..
[21:55] <omega_> doh
[21:55] <wtay> hehe
[21:55] <steveb> so they failed auditing then
[21:56] <wtay> even if you ship it with RSA2048 bits authentication only you won't even pass an audit
[21:57] sienap (synap at ipc379c226.dial.wxs.nl) joined #gstreamer.
[21:57] <sienap> back
[21:57] Kuroyi (rick at ubr-35.82.223.wmelbourne.cfl.rr.com) left irc: Read error to Kuroyi[ubr-35.82.223.wmelbourne.cfl.rr.com]: EOF from client
[21:58] <shitowax> bye everybody
[21:58] <sienap> bye 
[21:58] <omega_> l8r
[21:59] shitowax (yann at Mix-Annecy-101-2-75.abo.wanadoo.fr) left #gstreamer.
[21:59] <sienap> hi erik
[21:59] <sienap> erik you saw my screenshot
[21:59] <sienap> of my plasma ?
[21:59] <omega_> no
[21:59] <sienap> *proud*
[22:00] <sienap> http://www.ipng.nl/snapsshot.png
[22:00] <sienap> it is for paranormal
[22:00] <wtay> btw, got "\ " working in -launch, will commit soon
[22:00] <sienap> however it is not finished yet
[22:00] <omega_> cool
[22:01] <sienap> omega you had a look ?
[22:01] <omega_> yup
[22:01] <hadess> wtay: cool
[22:01] <sienap> i know it isn't that much but i am just proud on it :)
[22:01] <sienap> the colors aren't right
[22:01] <sienap> but paranormal fixes that anyway
[22:01] <omega_> is it a paranormal effect?
[22:01] <wtay> hadess, omega_: did you know that \"location=bla\ gg.mp3\" also worked?
[22:02] <wtay> err \"location=bla gg.mp3\" 
[22:02] <hadess> wtay: hmm
[22:02] <omega_> yeah, but bash doesn't autocomplete to that
[22:02] <sienap> oemga it going to be
[22:02] <wtay> true
[22:02] <sienap> i am first trying it with sdl
[22:02] <sienap> i am going to port it to paranormal later..
[22:02] <sienap> but i need some help from the paranormal author
[22:03] thomas (thomas at adsl-63562.turboline.skynet.be) joined #gstreamer.
[22:03] <sienap> but he hasn't been on this day :(
[22:03] <sienap> hej thomas!
[22:05] <wtay> as a nice side-effect of the escaped chars your filename can also contain {}[] etc..
[22:06] <omega_> has this whole gnome thread managed to make its way to gst-devel
[22:06] <omega_> ?
[22:07] <wtay> sorta, yes
[22:07] <sienap> *G*
[22:07] mattsm (mattsm at adsl-216-62-180-169.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net) joined #gstreamer.
[22:08] <wtay> yo
[22:11] <sienap> ehj matt
[22:13] <mattsm> ehj?
[22:14] Nick change: taazzzz -> taaz
[22:15] <wtay>  ./gstreamer-launch gnomevfssrc location=http://gstreamer.net/media/testsuite/audio-test.tar.gz ! pipefilter \"command=tar -tvz\" ! { fdsink }
[22:15] <wtay> :)
[22:16] Nick change: omega_ -> omega_away
[22:25] <wtay> taaz: ?
[22:25] <taaz> ?
[22:26] richardb (richard at ixion.tartarus.org) joined #gstreamer.
[22:26] <richardb> wooo
[22:26] <wtay> what are you doing with mpeg2 currently? still looking at it?
[22:26] <wtay> hi richardb!
[22:26] <richardb> hi!  Apologies for my extended absence...
[22:26] <taaz> with mpeg2?  not much... should i be doing something?
[22:27] <wtay> taaz: hmm, like OMS porting? :)
[22:27] <hadess> hey richardb
[22:27] <richardb> Just catching up on mail: things look good.
[22:27] <wtay> yeah
[22:27] <richardb> This paranormal thing looks nice.
[22:27] <wtay> taaz: why I ask: I'm going to rev the subtitle stuff
[22:28] <taaz> wtay: yeah i'm working on that a bit.  i thought you meant the mpeg2dec plugin
[22:28] <taaz> ok ;)  go right ahead!
[22:28] <taaz> i havent looked at that stuff at all...
[22:28] <wtay> ok
[22:28] <wtay> richardb: and we got our first closed source plugin :)
[22:28] <taaz> but hey, if it 'just works' when i get around to needing it that would be great
[22:28] <wtay> taaz: it will <g>
[22:29] <richardb> wtay: the quicktime one?
[22:29] <wtay> taaz: also libcss has caught my attention
[22:29] <wtay> richardb: yup
[22:29] <richardb> Anyone looked into getting synaesthesia plugin to work recently?
[22:29] <hadess> wtay: it's not in the cvs i hope
[22:30] <wtay> hadess: the quicktime code is, the 3ivx plugin isn't
[22:30] <wtay> richardb: nope
[22:30] <richardb> Hmm.
[22:31] <wtay> richardb: I tried to get it to work some time ago and failed...
[22:31] <taaz> what did you want to do with libcss?  a nice end user approach is to just attempt to dlopen it and if it doesn't exist then no css support
[22:31] <richardb> wtay: me too.
[22:31] <wtay> taaz: I though about a configure check and #ifdef on its presence
[22:32] <taaz> heh... looking for a 1G mem footprint without the automake fix? ;)
[22:32] <wtay> richardb: what do you think?
[22:32] <richardb> wtay: think it might need redoing from scratch.
[22:32] <wtay> taaz: yeah
[22:32] <wtay> richardb: yeah, me too
[22:33] <richardb> wtay: I did the synaesthesia plugin for alsaplayer a couple of years ago - took me about 2 hours, IIRC.
[22:33] <wtay> richardb: :-)
[22:34] <wtay> richardb: maybe you can make a real gstreamer plugin out of it, with a src pad that outputs raw video
[22:34] <richardb> wtay: That would definitely be the right way...
[22:34] <richardb> Where can I read up on the format that a raw video stream should be in?
[22:35] <wtay> richardb: only in the source code...
[22:35] <wtay> richardb: most of them use YUV though
[22:35] <richardb> Ho hum.  Right.
[22:35] <wtay> richardb: anyway, I wouldn't mind having it output the video in YUV
[22:35] Action: richardb goes to read source code and document things, before this...
[22:36] <richardb> What would the format of a YUV data be?
[22:36] <richardb> ;-)
[22:36] <wtay> widthxheight pixels of luminance, 2x w/2xh/2 chroma samples
[22:37] <richardb> So, not interlaced at all?
[22:37] <wtay> problem is that we don't handle paletted video yet
[22:38] <wtay> richardb: no
[22:38] <taaz> wtay: one reason to do runtime libcss loading is to help out packaging maintainers (ie, me).  probably can't put css code itself into debian but would be nice if it would compile support if headers are there at compile time but only do the linking at runtime
[22:38] <wtay> taaz: good point
[22:38] <hadess> wtay: how does the spectrum analyser work ?
[22:39] <wtay> hadess: takes raw audio, does a fft and draws it on a gdk_pixmap
[22:40] <taaz> libcss needs to be cleaned up too. improve api, have error handler callbacks, simplify the crypto code, etc, etc
[22:40] <hadess> wtay: i'd need to modify it then, if i want something that fits in my gui...
[22:40] <wtay> taaz: you think it's a bad idea to base code on it?
[22:40] <wtay> hadess: yes, you probably want to insert your own xvideosink in the gui...
[22:41] <taaz> wtay: it works... just could be improved
[22:41] <wtay> taaz: anyone still working on it?
[22:41] <thomas> wtay: when I run gstreamer-inspect volenv, the element arguments are of type unknown...
[22:41] <hadess> wtay: hmm, i want to draw in inside a custom status widget based on the canvas
[22:41] <thomas> ... but I do have them registered in the plugin
[22:41] <thomas> what could I be doing wrong ?
[22:41] <wtay> thomas: checking
[22:42] <wtay> hadess: you want the raw spectrum then?
[22:43] <hadess> wtay: simply data (numbers) that i would draw myself ?
[22:43] <wtay> thomas: it's an inspect issue, it doesn't show floats/doubles/strings
[22:43] <wtay> hadess: yes
[22:43] <hadess> wtay: i guess i want that then
[22:43] <thomas> wtay: any particular reason for that ?
[22:43] <wtay> hadess: ok, I wanted to do a generic FFT plugin anyway
[22:44] <wtay> hadess: so you can specify the number of bands yourself and stuff
[22:44] <wtay> thomas: not implemented, fixing now...
[22:44] <hadess> wtay: i can show you a screenshot of what i want to achieve
[22:44] <wtay> hadess: sure
[22:45] <wtay> thomas: something else is wrong...
[22:46] <hadess> wtay: hadess.net/guadec/Picture5.pict.png
[22:46] <wtay> The page you requested is not available.
[22:47] <hadess> wtay: should be there now
[22:48] <sienap> wtay is divx more then one layer of compression ?
[22:48] <wtay> sienap: what do you mean?
[22:49] Nick change: Ura_food -> Uraeus
[22:49] <wtay> hadess: ok I see what you mean
[22:49] <wtay> hi Uraeus
[22:49] <wtay> thomas: something is seriously wrong with the arg print in -inspect...
[22:49] <sienap> wtay he someone is blaatign against me
[22:49] <Uraeus> hi wtay, I think I found the solution to our audit challege
[22:49] <wtay> sienap: who?
[22:49] <wtay> Uraeus: aha!
[22:49] <sienap> that gstreamer should be able to decompress a part of divx and then throw it on the netwerk so slower computers can decode the rest
[22:49] <sienap> or soemthing
[22:49] <sienap> i don't get it either
[22:50] <sienap> wtay someone at ircnet (bodymilk)
[22:50] <sienap> he thniks that divx is more then one compression
[22:50] <sienap> or soemthing strange
[22:50] <sienap> i don't get it either
[22:50] <thomas> wtay: hmmm... I'll leave it for now then
[22:50] <thomas> wtay: so that probably means my stuff works for now ;)
[22:50] <wtay> thomas: I'm trying to track it down
[22:50] <wtay> sienap: AFAIK divx is just mpeg2 on steroids
[22:51] <sienap> wtay yeah i dno't follow him either
[22:51] <Uraeus> wtay: I am writing a mail about it to the list, but my main suggestion is that I write us a security audit stragety document which specifies some long term goals for us. that way we show that we are serious about it, yet don't have to spend time on it at this early time
[22:51] <sienap> he says gstreamer sucks if it can't do this
[22:51] <sienap> nothing can do this
[22:51] <sienap> because it is impossible
[22:51] <sienap> you can not just decode a part of the the compression so another computer can decode the rest
[22:51] <wtay> Uraeus: you're a manager, I can see that :-)
[22:54] <Uraeus> wtay: hehe, I pretend that was meant as a compliment :)
[22:54] <wtay> sienap: it's a tradeoff, decompressed video is soo much bigger to send of the wire
[22:54] <wtay> Uraeus: uhm.. yeah
[22:54] <sienap> wtay i tried to explain that
[22:54] <sienap> now he is babblign about it is multiply layered
[22:54] <sienap> or soemthing
[22:54] <wtay> divx? or mpeg4?
[22:54] <sienap> divx
[22:54] <wtay> I doubt it
[22:54] <hadess> wtay: yeah, seems Uraeus likes writing documents and roadmaps, next he will get us to fill in an MS Project document :P
[22:54] <hadess> Uraeus: where's your Pert-graph :)
[22:54] <Uraeus> hmm, our old buddy Njaard just joined #gnome wonder what he want 
[22:55] <wtay> Uraeus: hmm, checking that one out :)
[22:55] sienap (synap at ipc379c226.dial.wxs.nl) left irc: changing servers
[22:56] <Uraeus> hadess: I am more in favour of wenus reports (weekly estimated network usage statistics) :)
[22:56] <hadess> Uraeus: sicko !
[22:56] <wtay> or a WECCS
[22:57] <wtay> weekly estimated cvs commit stats
[22:57] <Uraeus> or the yearly version called anus (annual network useage statistics)
[22:57] <wtay> up yours :-)
[22:58] sienap (synap at ipc379c226.dial.wxs.nl) joined #gstreamer.
[22:58] Action: hadess implements saving
[22:58] <sienap> wtay and about mp3 ? is this a 3 layer compression ?
[22:59] <wtay> sienap: uhm, no, not that I know
[22:59] <sienap> indeed
[22:59] <sienap> the dude is really babbling non-sense
[22:59] <sienap> the problem is that i can't really defend my self either :)
[23:00] walken (foobar at c1583255-a.smateo1.sfba.home.com) joined #gstreamer.
[23:00] <wtay> yo walken
[23:00] <walken> yop
[23:00] <hadess> wtay: know the difference between delete and destroy events ?
[23:00] <walken> in X ?
[23:01] <hadess> yep
[23:01] <wtay> hadess: not offhand, no
[23:01] <walken> delete asks nicely
[23:01] <walken> destroy just does it
[23:01] <wtay> use delete :-)
[23:01] <sienap> walken!
[23:01] <hadess> no, i'm trying to see which events i need to catch to close my app correctly
[23:02] <walken> hi sien
[23:03] <wtay> hadess: I think you need destroy
[23:03] <hadess> wtay: trying to catch both, just in case =)
[23:08] <richardb> Hmm: automake 1.4f released.  Should contain patch needed for gstreamer: testing... ;-)
[23:08] <Uraeus> hi richardb long time no see
[23:09] <richardb> Uraeus: hi.
[23:10] <richardb> Uraeus: I've been away (Lisbon), and then busy looking for gainful employment...
[23:10] <Uraeus> richardb: found any gainful employment?
[23:10] <wtay> richardb: looking for a new job?
[23:11] <richardb> Looking into starting a company...
[23:11] <wtay> cool, what'll be the core business?
[23:12] <richardb> Search technology...
[23:12] <richardb> Hopefully open-source.
[23:12] <richardb> I have some potential customers, and a very useful set of people helping me.  But am having to write lots of planning documents...
[23:12] <richardb> And learn powerpoint.
[23:12] <wtay> eek
[23:12] <sienap> he some gstreamer related stuff as well  >:) ?
[23:12] <Uraeus> richardb: use magicpoint instead :)
[23:12] <richardb> sienap: probably not... :(
[23:12] <hadess> richardb: have a job for me =)
[23:12] <sienap> hehe
[23:13] <richardb> Uraeus: does it do organograms?  I've been told to make organograms. *grin*
[23:13] <richardb> (Whatever they are)
[23:13] <Uraeus> richardb: I have no f** idea what a organogram is :)
[23:13] <Uraeus> organogram == diagram of organs?
[23:13] <richardb> Me neither, yet.  I need to see a version of powerpoint to work out what they are, I think.
[23:14] steveb (steveb at node1ee0a.a2000.nl) left irc: [x]chat
[23:14] <richardb> I think its a diagram of people and their roles and how they interrelate.
[23:14] <richardb> Gnumeric's being very helpful for financial planning, though.  I'd never used a spreadsheet in anger before.
[23:14] <wtay> Organogram: a picture of the hierarchy of the company
[23:15] <richardb> wtay: that sounds about right: thanks.
[23:15] <wtay> actually you said it better then I did
[23:16] <richardb> Currently, I think it might be:  [Richard Boulton] - [everything]
[23:16] Action: thomas finally has nice dvd video on his gbox
[23:16] <thomas> not sure if it works right on the tv though
[23:16] <thomas> man this stuff is complicated
[23:17] <sienap> what stuff ?
[23:17] <wtay> richardb: [Richard Boulton] -> [CEO, CTO, CSO, ...]
[23:17] Parapraxis (Spluzz at user-2ivedos.dialup.mindspring.com) joined #gstreamer.
[23:18] <wtay> much better
[23:18] <wtay> yo
[23:18] Action: richardb grins
[23:18] <thomas> sienap: tv out under linux
[23:18] <Uraeus> thomas: you are making a tv out plugin?
[23:19] Action: Uraeus readies the roadmap
[23:19] <thomas> Uraeus: no, I'm just trying to get an ati rage 128 to work with tv out ;)
[23:19] <Parapraxis> howdee
[23:19] <thomas> what do you mean, tv out plugin ?
[23:19] <sienap> PARAPRAXIS!!!
[23:19] <Parapraxis> ...
[23:19] <sienap> hehehe :)
[23:19] <sienap> Parapraxis: http://www.ipng.nl/snapsshot.png my little tryout for now
[23:19] <Parapraxis> heh ;)
[23:19] <Uraeus> thomas: well I guess having a plugin directing output to a graphics cards tv-out port
[23:19] <sienap> i need you to help me with impletting it in paranormal
[23:20] <sienap> since i can't get it really done till now
[23:20] <thomas> Uraeus: it would be *great* if that would be possible so that no yuv-rgb-yuv conversion is necessary
[23:20] sienap_ (synap at ipc379c226.dial.wxs.nl) joined #gstreamer.
[23:20] <sienap> ehm
[23:20] <sienap> ?
[23:20] <thomas> Uraeus: but so far I haven't found anything on it
[23:20] sienap_ (synap at ipc379c226.dial.wxs.nl) left irc: Read error to sienap_[ipc379c226.dial.wxs.nl]: EOF from client
[23:20] <sienap> wtf
[23:20] <sienap> ?
[23:20] <sienap> parapraxis look at query
[23:20] <sienap> :)
[23:21] <Uraeus> thomas: well if you have a card with a tv-out port I guess experimenting with making such a plug-in should be possible, but I guess the downside is it being hardware specific
[23:21] <thomas> Uraeus: I've never done much video coding, I'm an audio guy
[23:21] <hadess> hey Parapraxis, how it goes ?
[23:22] <thomas> Uraeus: I can hardly switch from xfree3 to xfree4 !
[23:22] <Parapraxis> hadess: it goes fine
[23:22] <Uraeus> thomas: :)
[23:23] <Parapraxis> hadess: how goes it w/ you? :)
[23:24] <hadess> Parapraxis: programming is going well
[23:24] <wtay> thomas: fix in CVS
[23:24] <Uraeus> thomas: since you are a audio guy we need a set of midi plugins hint hint :)
[23:24] <walken> grumpf
[23:24] <walken> debian postfix wont upgrade
[23:24] <thomas> Uraeus: *real* audio, no midi stuff ;)
[23:25] <thomas> I've done a lot on mpeg stuff
[23:25] <hadess> Parapraxis: if your plugin is ready by then, i think i'll be able to include it in my app this week
[23:25] <thomas> Uraeus: though I did code some sort of music stuff under dos for adlib
[23:25] <walken> thomas. mpeg audio coding ?
[23:25] <walken> thomas. what do you think of ac3 vs mp3
[23:25] <Parapraxis> hadess: cool
[23:25] <thomas> which reminds me... anyone want to buy my original boxed adlib with programmer manual ?
[23:25] <sienap> hadess: i hope i can finish some of my actuators as well then..
[23:26] <wtay> thomas: yeah, for -$10 :)
[23:26] <walken> hehe... adlib :)
[23:26] <hadess> Parapraxis: do you plan to include your plugin in the gst cvs, or separately ?
[23:26] Action: walken is amazed to remember it was actually selling well
[23:27] <thomas> walken: ac3, is that atrac or what's used in DVD ?
[23:27] <hadess> my first sound card was a MAD16 :P
[23:27] <Parapraxis> hadess: I thought it would be separate (since it still will have xmms & standalone support, and since gst seems poluted enough already)
[23:27] Action: walken was a gravis guy, until he realized they would never try to sell it much
[23:27] <hadess> Parapraxis: fair enough
[23:27] <thomas> atrac's close to mpeg layer II - which is better for realtime stuff than mp3
[23:27] <walken> its used in DVDs
[23:27] Action: walken hates mp3
[23:28] <thomas> is ac3 open, btw ? It's sony's stuff, right ?
[23:28] <hadess> walken: gravis sound cards have been the nirvana of demo coders all over europe :)
[23:28] Action: walken thinks layer 2 is fine
[23:28] <thomas> walken: why ?
[23:28] <thomas> walken: layer2 is better for a lot of stuff
[23:28] <thomas> it's also easier to code
[23:28] <walken> hadess - I know, I was one of them :)
[23:28] <walken> thomas. layer 3 is such a mess
[23:28] <walken> ac3 is like 10x simpler and actually more efficient
[23:28] <Parapraxis> hadess: you disagree?
[23:28] <thomas> walken: ac3 is more intensive, right ?
[23:28] <hadess> i like layer3, as long as i don't have to code it
[23:28] <thomas> I mean, CPU-wise
[23:29] <wtay> isn't ac3 from dobly or something
[23:29] <walken> yes, its more intensive
[23:29] <hadess> Parapraxis: no, that's alright
[23:29] <walken> yup its the dolby standard
[23:29] <thomas> layer3 has it's benefits
[23:29] <Parapraxis> hadess: okie ;)
[23:29] <thomas> but it has some bad things as well...
[23:29] Nick change: richardb -> richardb-away
[23:29] <thomas> ...try encoding a live cd !
[23:29] <thomas> walken: but I think that mp3's at 192 kbit/sec are very good quality
[23:30] <thomas> walken: but the app I made put out data in mpeg layer 2
[23:30] <walken> ok
[23:30] <thomas> walken: is ac3 open ?
[23:30] <walken> yeah... its ATSC standard A-52
[23:31] <wtay> it does have a lot of patents IIRC
[23:31] <thomas> no royalties, no nothing ?
[23:31] <walken> you can actually find the like on www.dolby.com and you follow the technical page
[23:31] <walken> well. about the same as mpeg or any other codec
[23:32] <thomas> walken: don't know... I hope to get a grip on ogg soon.
[23:32] <sienap> Hadess why the heck are you ignoring me ?
[23:32] <walken> lots of claims, noone knows if any of them is valid, and they dont try to enforce it on decoders (I'd be more worried for an encoder though)
[23:32] <Uraeus> wtay: I now have a sourceforge account, could I be added to the developer list on SF?
[23:32] <thomas> walken: I like what they did
[23:32] <thomas> walken: I've always been in the gray about the consequences for my app...
[23:32] <thomas> licenses always mention encoder or decoder...
[23:32] <walken> the ogg people ? I didnt looked closely at their audio codec but I heard it rocks
[23:32] <wtay> Uraeus: account?
[23:33] <walken> is it based on an imdct ?
[23:33] <Uraeus> wtay: SF login
[23:33] <thomas> ... while my app didn't do a *full* decode/encode
[23:33] <wtay> Uraeus: yes, what is it?
[23:33] <thomas> so I wouldn't even know what license would apply
[23:33] <Uraeus> wtay: theuraeus
[23:33] <wtay> lol
[23:33] <Uraeus> wtay: some freak had stolen my nick
[23:33] <wtay> hehehe
[23:33] <thomas> walken: I can't really tell for sure, but it seems to have adaptive filterbanks...
[23:33] <thomas> and some sort of progressive quality (like the one used in progressive jpegs)
[23:34] <thomas> which is a very nice feature
[23:34] <walken> adaptive as in using several transform lenghts depending on what transients you get ?
[23:34] <walken> or adaptive in frequency bands
[23:34] <walken> yumm
[23:34] <thomas> walken: AFAIK, in frequency bands... but I'm not sure
[23:34] <thomas> I haven't gone through the code yet
[23:34] <walken> ok
[23:35] <walken> hmmm, should take a look sometime
[23:35] <thomas> but it probably does window switching as well
[23:35] <wtay> Uraeus: field of expertise? 
[23:35] <thomas> in a better way than mpeg
[23:36] Action: thomas is going to bed
[23:36] <wtay> thomas: 'night
[23:37] <wtay> Uraeus: distributor/promotor?
[23:38] <sienap> nite thomas
[23:38] <thomas> bye all
[23:38] thomas (thomas at adsl-63562.turboline.skynet.be) left irc: Client Exiting
[23:39] arik (arik at sdn-ar-002waseatP043.dialsprint.net) joined #gstreamer.
[23:39] <hadess> hey arik
[23:39] <arik> hey
[23:39] <arik> how goes it?
[23:39] <hadess> Parapraxis: can i ask you for a feature ?
[23:40] <Uraeus> wtay: spiritual guidance
[23:40] <Uraeus> wtay: distributor/promotor is probably good :)
[23:40] <wtay> too bad I cannot create a category myself :-)
[23:41] <ajmitch> personal motivator? ;)
[23:41] <Uraeus> ajmitch: since I am a failure in that department I think we don't use that title :)
[23:42] <ajmitch> failure how?
[23:42] Action: ajmitch looks at clock & contemplates going to the psychology lecture @ 10
[23:44] <arik> hwh
[23:44] <arik> it's sunday
[23:45] <ajmitch> not here ;)
[23:45] <arik> ah
[23:45] <arik> suck
[23:45] <ajmitch> Mon May 21 09:45:57 NZST 2001
[23:45] <arik> ;-P
[23:45] <Uraeus> ajmitch: I only demotivated you, I think that counts as a failure
[23:46] <arik> Sun May 20 02:48:30 PST 2001
[23:47] Action: sienap is mad at hadess
[23:48] <arik> i'm done with 0.9.1 work!
[23:48] Kuroyi (rick at ubr-35.82.223.wmelbourne.cfl.rr.com) joined #gstreamer.
[23:48] <arik> at least for now
[23:48] <ajmitch> Uraeus: you didn't really demotivate me, honest ;)
[23:48] <sienap> arik for what ?
[23:49] <arik> sienap: mozilla
[23:49] <sienap> he cool
[23:49] <sienap> what is new ?
[23:50] <sienap> btw you are the guy working on gstmediaplay in mozilla ?
[23:50] <sienap> uraeus i found an sawfish bug: http://www.ipng.nl/~cliff/bugsnapsshot.png
[23:50] <arik> yes
[23:50] <arik> well theoretically
[23:50] <sienap> arik he cool
[23:50] <sienap> how is it going ?
[23:50] <arik> haven't started ;-) i'm also the guy who does gstmediaplay not in mozilla
[23:51] Nick change: ajmitch -> aj_uni
[23:51] <arik> been busy with that and work
[23:51] Action: hadess proudly presents the first version of the file format of rhythmbox' playlist
[23:52] <sienap> hadess show us
[23:52] <Parapraxis> hadess: sure ;)
[23:52] <sienap> arik he cool is it going well ? what are the plans ?
[23:52] <hadess> sienap: there's nothing to show
[23:52] <sienap> hadess "proudly presents" :)
[23:52] <Uraeus> sienap: a redraw bug?
[23:52] <arik> hehe
[23:52] <sienap> uraeus yep
[23:52] <arik> many plans
[23:52] <sienap> arik a summary ? :)
[23:52] <arik> hadess: i may steal that format
[23:53] <hadess> arik: xml stuff, i can send you a copy when i'm finished with it
[23:53] <arik> sienap: playlists, full screen, double size, more controls, fix breakage, visualizations at some point, other stuf...
[23:53] <arik> hadess: sure, thanks
[23:53] <arik> hadess: i may just go with the .m3u format
[23:53] <arik> it is easier
[23:54] <sienap> arik visualizations are already taken care off
[23:54] <sienap> parapraxis is working on the vis department
[23:54] <sienap> and i am making more actuators for him
[23:54] <sienap> the vis stuff is going to yadayada too the videosink
[23:54] <sienap> :)
[23:54] <hadess> arik: this one is more complicated as it saves the attributes of the files (the id3 tags and stuff)
[23:54] <wtay> hadess: isn't your playlist a bonobo component
[23:54] <wtay> ?
[23:54] <Parapraxis> hadess: what feature did you want?
[23:55] <hadess> wtay: not anymore, was too complicated to manage
[23:55] <wtay> :(
[23:55] <arik> hadess: ah ok
[23:55] <arik> hadess: i'm going for simplicity for the moment in gstmediaplay
[23:55] <hadess> Parapraxis: would it be possible to show a b&w logo when the vis is first started ?
[23:55] <wtay> a shared playlist component would be nice...
[23:56] <arik> yeah it would
[23:56] <hadess> wtay: the playlist i have is faaaar from what xmms uses for example
[23:56] <wtay> hadess: in what way features or suckage?
[23:56] <hadess> wtay: and i don't think you want to use that in gstmediaplay
[23:56] <arik> hmm
[23:56] <arik> prob not
[23:56] <sienap> hadess just make an acturator for that
[23:56] <arik> but at the moment i am doing massive gstplay code cleanup
[23:56] <Parapraxis> hadess: it depends what you mean
[23:57] <wtay> Uraeus: hehehe
[23:57] <sienap> hadess i think i can make something for that
[23:57] <sienap> if you want me too
[23:57] <hadess> wtay: my "playlist" is handling a library of songs, and multiple playlists
[23:57] <Uraeus> wtay: you read my mail ?
[23:57] <hadess> sienap: lemme check w/ Parapraxis first
[23:57] <wtay> Uraeus: yeah
[23:57] <hadess> Parapraxis: have you seen the apple adverts for itunes ?
[23:57] <Parapraxis> hadess: right now, I'm not too sure how the config will be done
[23:58] <Parapraxis> hadess: nope, I haven't
[23:58] <wtay> hadess: that's way better than xmms's 
[23:58] <Uraeus> wtay: after reading that mail, can you even begin to phantom that Ximian didn't hire me as a project manager?
[23:58] <hadess> Parapraxis: when the visualisation is first started, there's an apple logo that "melts" in the vis
[23:58] <wtay> Uraeus: 'cause they're clueless :)
[23:58] <sienap> hadess ok
[23:59] <arik> Uraeus: you applied at ximian?
[23:59] <hadess> Uraeus: huh, you need to get a spellchecker dude...
[23:59] <sienap> hadess that could be done by fading an image out..
[23:59] <hadess> sienap: not quite
[23:59] <hadess> lemme try to find a shot
[23:59] <sienap> hadess ok
[23:59] <Uraeus> arik: I did, but they didn't even bother responding with a 'no thank you' :(
[23:59] <wtay> Uraeus: can you write something so that I never have to fix segfaults? <g>
[23:59] <sienap> now i am playing with sdl anyway i can check out sdl_image i guess
[23:59] <Parapraxis> hadess: It will definitely be possible at some point, but right now I don't think there's any easy way to fit it in
[23:59] <sienap> parapraxis why not ?
[23:59] <arik> Uraeus: well i that case they prob didn't get it, they are massively dissorganized
[00:00] --- Mon May 21 2001
[00:00] <Uraeus> wtay: I am not THAT pointy haired yet :)
[00:00] <sienap> parapraxis you can make a plugin draw an image
[00:00] <wtay> hehe
[00:00] <sienap> and modify it when time pasts
[00:00] <arik> not that i am defending ximian
[00:00] <sienap> like fading it out
[00:00] <sienap> or in
[00:00] <sienap> or hell do i know
[00:00] <sienap> :)
[00:00] <arik> i just know what i'm talking about
[00:00] <hadess> sienap, Parapraxis: hadess.net/guadec/visualize_notfullscreen.jpg
[00:00] <Parapraxis> hadess: pn's way of being configured is somewhat different from how gst plugins are, so I'm not sure how it would work ;)
[00:00] <arik> hadess: i always thought that apple thing was lame
[00:01] <Parapraxis> hadess: you see, I'm not sure how to divide control of pn between the application and the user
[00:02] <Uraeus> arik: I sent it directly to Nat :( and even cc to Michael 
[00:02] <sienap> parapraxis it would be nice if we could cycle between containers
[00:02] <sienap> then we can first draw an image.. 
[00:02] <sienap> keep it there for some seconds
[00:02] <Parapraxis> hadess: can you expliain to me how the image would be given to pn through gst?
[00:02] <sienap> and start cycling with containers
[00:02] <sienap> but don't update the image anymore
[00:02] <sienap> so it slowly fades away
[00:02] <arik> Uraeus: oh well... can't say i would recommend working there, it's a bit... much
[00:02] <hadess> Parapraxis: an argument of your plugin...
[00:03] <arik> but i did have a good time for the most part
[00:03] <wtay> uhm, no
[00:03] <sienap> hadess that is alpha trans the image ?
[00:03] <wtay> I would create a request pad for aditional images that are blended with the effect
[00:03] <arik> i'll be back later
[00:03] <Uraeus> arik: well I am more disapointed at not getting a reply than at not getting a job actually
[00:03] <wtay> then you can play a movie whith the effect too
[00:03] <Parapraxis> hadess: so it would just be a single hard-coded feature?  that's easily doable
[00:03] <arik> Uraeus: yeah i can undertand that
[00:03] <arik> later all
[00:03] arik (arik at sdn-ar-002waseatP043.dialsprint.net) left irc: leaving
[00:03] <wtay> hadess: Parapraxis: no
[00:04] <wtay> I would create a request pad for aditional images that are blended with the effect
[00:04] <wtay> then you can play a movie whith the effect too
[00:04] <Parapraxis> wtay: ick.
[00:04] <Parapraxis> wtay: hehe... ;)
[00:04] <hadess> wtay: why would you want that ?
[00:04] <wtay> howso "ick"
[00:04] <sienap> parapraxis what about my idea
[00:04] <Parapraxis> wtay: things like that will need to wait a little while I think...
[00:05] <sienap> like in draw the image
[00:05] <sienap> and then the vis cycle
[00:05] <sienap> so the images gets blured away by other visuals
[00:05] <wtay> hadess: cause passing an image with gtk_object_set is insane
[00:05] <sienap> other thing that is possible is using sdl's alphatransparency thingy
[00:05] <Parapraxis> wtay: I need to do some redesign of pn's arch, so that it can do things like blending two things together
[00:05] <sienap> i am not sure what hadess wants
[00:05] <hadess> wtay: not passing an image, just a path to it an xbm, that's all
[00:06] <wtay> hadess: a path?
[00:06] <wtay> hadess: in xbm, why not xpm or png?
[00:06] <hadess> wtay: yeah, a file path to an image
[00:06] <hadess> wtay: that's just to show the logo of the app, nothing else
[00:06] <Parapraxis> hadess: yeah, that's quite possible... what wtay was saying is sort of the more long-term goal (and would be done by making a 'gstream_vidsink' actuator)
[00:06] <sienap> hadess please tell me what you want.. alpha fading or let is blur away it the vis cycle ?
[00:07] <wtay> Parapraxis: hadess: ok, for now then
[00:07] <hadess> sienap: depends on what sort of vis it is, usually, it blends in the vis
[00:08] <sienap> hadess ehm blends like alpha fade or blur away
[00:08] <Parapraxis> hadess: you have to remember, however, that paranormal uses paletted color, so it may not look exactly how you want it to ;0
[00:08] <hadess> Parapraxis: if it shows up, it's good
[00:09] <Parapraxis> okie
[00:10] <sienap> hadess so it is still not clear for me what i should hack on
[00:10] <sienap> alpha blending or not
[00:10] <Parapraxis> what's the proper way to debug gst plugins?  do you attach a gdb to tools/.lib/lt-gstreamer-launch?
[00:11] <hadess> sienap: i think Parapraxis wants to take care of this
[00:11] <sienap> parapraxis you want to take care of this ?
[00:11] <Parapraxis> sienap: I'll do this in the gstreamer glue
[00:11] <sienap> or want me to make an actuator for it ?
[00:11] <hadess> Parapraxis: libtool ./gstreamer-launch ...
[00:11] <sienap> he ok
[00:12] <wtay> Parapraxis: libtool gdb ./gstreamer-launch
[00:12] Action: wtay compiles parenormal
[00:12] <hadess> oops, i forgot gdb...
[00:13] <Parapraxis> where is the gstreamer-launch?  in tools/ or tools/.libs?
[00:13] <wtay> tools
[00:13] <Parapraxis> tools/gstreamer-launch is a shell script
[00:13] <wtay> Parapraxis: yup, that why you need libtool gdb in front of it
[00:13] <Parapraxis> oh, oops... nm
[00:13] Action: Parapraxis is silly
[00:14] <sienap> hadess you don't have that much faith in me huh ?
[00:14] Nick change: Parapraxis -> Para[food]
[00:15] <hadess> sienap: dude, he wrote the plugin, so stop annoying me will you ?
[00:15] <sienap> yeah ofcourse i am annoying you again..
[00:17] <sienap> hadess i don't know what i did wrong too you
[00:17] <sienap> but you are acting really annoyed the last week..
[00:17] <sienap> and i don't like it
[00:17] <sienap> and if you just tell me why you are acting like that
[00:18] richardb-away (richard at ixion.tartarus.org) left irc: [BX] I wonder what this button marked "EOF" does...
[00:18] <sienap> *sniff* 
[00:20] <sienap> he
[00:20] <sienap> grr
[00:23] <sienap> *grr* i will make an image actuator anyway
[00:25] <Uraeus> sienap: heh, one line of code speaks more than a thousand words, is that the attitude?
[00:26] <sienap> uraeus he
[00:30] <Uraeus> night lads
[00:30] Uraeus (cschalle at c224s9h5.upc.chello.no) left #gstreamer.
[00:32] <wtay> hadess: how do you play from cd with xmms?
[00:35] <hadess> wtay: check the cd plugin in the inputs
[00:36] <hadess> wtay: you need to browse to the CD mountpoint, you'll see the tracks there
[00:38] <sienap> those tracks are just some kind of .wav ?
[00:41] <wtay> hadess: ok thc
[00:41] <wtay> thx even
[00:42] <sienap> thc huh >:)
[00:56] <wtay> i gotta sleep :(
[00:56] <wtay> cya
[00:56] Nick change: wtay -> wtay-zZz
[00:57] <sienap> sleep well
[01:17] <hadess> ...not far from basic functionality in the playlist...
[01:18] <sienap> ?
[01:19] <sienap> ./ixalance: error while loading shared libraries: libmidas-1.1.so.2: cannot load shared object file: No such file or directory
[01:19] <sienap> oops
[01:19] <sienap> :)
[01:19] <sienap> wrong server
[01:19] Nick change: Para[food] -> Parapraxis
[01:19] <sienap> parapraxis
[01:19] <Parapraxis> hehe
[01:20] <hadess> heh, i remember libmidas from back in the days of the DOS games :)
[01:23] Nick change: omega_away -> omega_nap
[01:26] <walken> hehh
[01:26] <walken> midas
[01:31] <Parapraxis> how hard is the port from GtkObject to GObject going to be?
[01:34] <hadess> :%s/GtkObject/GObject/g should do the job for the most part =)
[01:35] <Parapraxis> really?  wow... I thought it was a bigger change than that
[01:35] <hadess> the hard changes are in glib/gtk
[01:35] <Parapraxis> heh... fine w/ me ;)
[01:37] Action: hadess tries to understand dodgy C++ id3lib
[01:39] <hadess> if somebody is willing to help with this code, i'll be more than delighted =)
[01:41] Action: Parapraxis runs away
[01:41] <hadess> i hate id3 tags
[01:43] <hadess> seems that not many of my mp3s have id3...
[01:45] <sienap> my either
[01:45] <sienap> xmms sometimes interprents the title really wrong because of that :(
[01:45] <sienap> or just no title to make it even worse
[01:50] <hadess> i think i ran a script not long ago to add id3 tags to all my mp3s, following my naming scheme
[01:52] <Parapraxis> what do you people think about paranormal being using rgb color (instead of the current paletted scheme where actuators can alter the palette)?
[01:53] <sienap> parapraxis it makes it more fleexible
[01:53] <sienap> however having a palette also is nice to make actuators adapt to each other
[01:53] <hadess> Parapraxis: whatever is the fastest, according to wtay rgb would be faster, but if the look of the effects is reduced significantly , better go with paletted
[01:54] <Parapraxis> hadess: I don't think the speed will be much of an issue (especially when I redo it to use MMX)
[01:55] <hadess> Parapraxis: heh, sure, mmx, right... there is no use for mmx here
[01:55] <Parapraxis> ?
[01:55] <hadess> Parapraxis: i have a g3
[01:55] <sienap> *G*
[01:55] <Parapraxis> ah ;)
[01:56] <Parapraxis> hadess: well, you're welcome to write asm for whatever SIMD the g*'s have ;)
[01:56] <Parapraxis> they must have something
[01:56] <hadess> Parapraxis: g4 have altivec, g3 don't have anything
[01:57] <Parapraxis> hadess: well, then yer skrewed ;)
[02:11] <Parapraxis> how does plugin error/warning reporting work?
[02:12] <hadess> none, right now
[02:12] <hadess> just try to fail gracefully when you can't do what you want
[02:13] <Parapraxis> okie
[02:16] <Parapraxis> how does the gtk object model handle what are virtual functions in C++?
[02:17] <Parapraxis> do some gtk_* functions just call a function in the object struct?
[02:19] <hadess> yep
[02:19] <Parapraxis> k
[02:56] <sienap> VIDEO:  [DIV3]  320x240  24bpp  12.00 fps  355.6 kbps (43.4 kbyte/s)
[02:56] <sienap> haha
[02:56] <sienap> die wil ik niet eens in m'n collectie
[02:56] <sienap> 12 fps man
[02:57] dobey (dobey at ip43.bedford8.ma.pub-ip.psi.net) joined #gstreamer.
[02:57] <hadess> hey dobey
[02:57] <sienap> dobey!
[02:58] dobey (dobey at ip43.bedford8.ma.pub-ip.psi.net) left irc: brb
[02:58] dobey (dobey at ip43.bedford8.ma.pub-ip.psi.net) joined #gstreamer.
[02:58] <dobey> hey
[02:58] <dobey> hrmm, there we go
[02:59] <hadess> damn thing crashes...
[03:01] <dobey> ?
[03:02] <hadess> i have some code that's buggy i guess
[03:02] <dobey> ah
[03:03] <hadess> heh, i was trying to free a string twice
[03:04] <sienap> G*
[03:04] <sienap> lol
[03:14] Nick change: aj_uni -> ajmitch
[03:17] <ajmitch> afternoon all ;)
[03:18] <hadess> hey ajmitch
[03:18] <hadess> early morning for me here
[03:19] <ajmitch> heh, how's rhythmbox going now?
[03:19] <dobey> heh
[03:20] <ajmitch> hi dobey
[03:20] <dobey> hey
[03:20] <hadess> ajmitch: nearly functional playlist/library
[03:21] <ajmitch> cool
[03:22] arik (arik at sdn-ar-001waseatP116.dialsprint.net) joined #gstreamer.
[03:22] <arik> commited
[03:22] <ajmitch> hi arik
[03:22] <arik> a bunch of little things
[03:22] <arik> hey 
[03:22] <hadess> arik: added changelog entry ?
[03:22] <ajmitch> cool, time for me to update then ;)
[03:23] <arik> hadess: nope
[03:23] <arik> hadess: there is not gstplay changelog
[03:23] <arik> need to add one
[03:23] <hadess> arik: would be nice, even if crude, that's the end-user app...
[03:23] <arik> i agree
[03:25] <ajmitch> arik: added 'open location' option?
[03:25] <arik> not yet
[03:25] <arik> gonna do that rsn
[03:25] <ajmitch> just wondering if i should bother removing what i did (conflicting with your changes)
[03:26] <arik> not if it is done
[03:26] <dobey> hrmm
[03:26] <arik> just change the code style if it is wrong ;-)
[03:26] <ajmitch> i didn't change much, and it's not done
[03:26] <arik> i made it gnome complient
[03:26] <arik> or at least more complient
[03:26] <arik> still need to change a bunch of things around abit
[03:26] <ajmitch> i started adding the support for open location, but didn't implement the actual file opening ;)
[03:28] <arik> right ;-)
[03:28] <arik> the hard bit
[03:28] <arik> does gst support uri's yet?
[03:28] <arik> maybe the gnome-vfs sink?
[03:28] <hadess> the gnomevfssrc supports http and ftp locations
[03:29] <ajmitch> that's where i didn't do anything... ;)
[03:29] <arik> ajmitch: sounds like a project for you ;-)
[03:29] <dobey> hrmm
[03:30] <ajmitch> arik: probably not a good idea to leave it to me - i'm gonna be studying for exams ;)
[03:30] <arik> hmm
[03:30] <arik> slimy bugger trying to weasel out of helping ;-P
[03:31] <ajmitch> arik: plus i'm trying to make sense of caps nego in plugins ;)
[03:31] <arik> ;-P
[03:31] Action: arik doesn't care
[03:31] <arik> hehe
[03:32] <hadess> hadess.net/guadec/rhythmbox-playlist.png
[03:32] <hadess> check this out =)
[03:32] <arik> alrighty
[03:33] Action: dobey larts hadess
[03:33] <ajmitch> hadess: yeah, looks quite good
[03:33] <arik> hadess: that is starting to look pretty neet
[03:33] <arik> why is the toolbar cut off?
[03:33] <hadess> library saved to xml, files added by drag'n'drop...
[03:34] <arik> neet
[03:34] <dobey> ooh
[03:34] <hadess> arik: gnome bug...
[03:34] <dobey> sexy theme ;-P
[03:34] <hadess> dobey: hee
[03:34] <arik> hadess: ah ;-P
[03:34] <Parapraxis> hadess: that looks nice
[03:34] <arik> hehe
[03:34] <arik> ugly theme
[03:34] Action: dobey smacks arik
[03:34] <arik> hehe
[03:34] <arik> sorry
[03:35] <ajmitch> hehe
[03:35] <Parapraxis> hadess: do apps create sinks for data to go into?  is it possible for an app to register an element whose life span is as long as it runs?
[03:35] Action: ajmitch loads glade & starts making changes
[03:35] <hadess> i think i can get it to _play_ music tonight, so that i can stop using xmms :)
[03:35] <arik> heh
[03:35] <arik> gstmediaplay doesn't play mp3's very well atm
[03:35] <arik> for some reason
[03:36] <hadess> Parapraxis: no, and yes
[03:36] <arik> hadess: changelog added
[03:36] <Parapraxis> hadess: good answer ;)
[03:36] <hadess> Parapraxis: the app creates elements, connects them, and "makes it spin"
[03:36] <arik> that is to say that it runs
[03:37] <arik> but no sound comes out
[03:37] <arik> ;-)
[03:37] <ajmitch> arik: now that's no use, is it? ;)
[03:37] <arik> not really ;-)
[03:37] <arik> anyway dinner
[03:37] <arik> bbiab
[03:37] <hadess> Parapraxis: so the app can choose to have a pipeline existing for the whole lifetime of this app, or (like gstmediaplay does) create pipelines on the fly, and destroy them when it's done with it
[03:37] arik (arik at sdn-ar-001waseatP116.dialsprint.net) left irc: leaving
[03:38] <Parapraxis> hadess: ok, say you wanted to create a pipeline that plays music & has a vis in it, but you want the vis to display in a window inside your app's main window
[03:38] <hadess> like what i do for example ?
[03:38] <Parapraxis> hadess: maybe... I don't know what you do :)
[03:38] <Parapraxis> where is the image displayed?
[03:39] <hadess> 'label 4'
[03:39] <Parapraxis> ... aasink?
[03:39] <hadess> no, xvideosink
[03:39] <Parapraxis> how do you retrieve the 'image' from xvideosink?
[03:40] <hadess> i don't retrieve it, i tell the videosink where to go, and it does what it has to do...
[03:41] <Parapraxis> ah, so there has to be a sink that supports whatever tk (or whatever) your app uses
[03:41] <ajmitch> bbl
[03:41] Nick change: ajmitch -> aj_uni
[03:42] <hadess> Parapraxis: no, i embed an X window, that's all (gdk calls)
[03:42] <Parapraxis> ah, ok
[03:42] <hadess> Parapraxis: to tell the truth, i've only played with the old videosink, not with the new xvideosink
[03:43] <sienap> also you can use sdlsink and aasink :)
[03:44] <sienap> aasink is beauty :)
[03:44] <Parapraxis> hehe :)
[03:44] Action: hadess adds gst code to his app
[03:45] <sienap> hadess *woooohhh*
[03:45] <sienap> hadess i think i've got mrrazz this far that is willing to make some cool 3d stuff for paranormal
[03:45] <sienap> else i have to travel to boxmeer tomorrow to make it some more clear to him >:)
[03:47] <Parapraxis> is it possible for an app to create an internal pad that sinks something into the app?
[03:47] <hadess> there's an fdsink and a lot of other stuff, so i think it is possible
[03:47] <Parapraxis> fdsink?
[03:48] <hadess> you want your xmms plugin to use gstreamer ?
[03:48] <Parapraxis> no, I was just curious
[03:48] <sienap> file discriptor..
[03:48] <Parapraxis> ah
[03:48] <sienap> so sockets and stuff
[03:49] <sienap> wtf.. my gnome terminal did something really weird
[03:49] <sienap> it flashed really really vast for 2 seconds
[03:57] <sienap> ok guys
[03:57] <sienap> i am off
[03:57] <sienap> Mon May 21 04:03:03 CEST 2001
[03:57] <sienap> damn :)
[03:57] sienap (synap at ipc379c226.dial.wxs.nl) left irc: sienap has no reason
[04:01] <walken> anyone here ?
[04:01] <hadess> walken: yep
[04:01] Action: walken has a lame question
[04:01] <hadess> fire up
[04:01] <walken> I want to try one of the icq clones
[04:01] <walken> I dont know which one is any good
[04:02] <hadess> what desktop you use ?
[04:02] <walken> fvwm2
[04:03] <hadess> licq has a lot of UIs, i personally use gnomeicu
[04:03] <walken> ok
[04:03] <walken> will try these
[04:03] <hadess> what's your UIN ?
[04:04] <dobey> gnomeicu is very good
[04:04] <walken> none
[04:04] <walken> never used icq at all
[04:04] <walken> resisted for so many years
[04:04] <walken> and then I was behind a firewall anyway
[04:04] <hadess> it's pretty handy
[04:04] <dobey> you could use the icq transport in gabber too
[04:04] <dobey> firewall blah
[04:04] <hadess> true
[04:04] <dobey> that's what ipmasq is for
[04:04] <hadess> dobey: depends if you have control on the firewall or not...
[04:04] <dobey> yeah
[04:05] <dobey> but still
[04:12] Nick change: omega_nap -> omega_
[04:13] <hadess> hey omega_
[04:13] <omega_> yo
[04:13] <walken> yop
[04:17] Parapraxis (Spluzz at user-2ivedos.dialup.mindspring.com) left irc: Read error to Parapraxis[user-2ivedos.dialup.mindspring.com]: EOF from client
[04:18] Action: hadess is writing rhythmbox_gst_init(), wonder what that could do :)
[04:19] <dobey> Gnome Startup Timer?
[04:19] <dobey> heh
[04:19] <dobey> good night dude
[04:19] <hadess> night
[04:19] dobey (dobey at ip43.bedford8.ma.pub-ip.psi.net) left irc: gnight
[04:20] <hadess> omega_: you have an example of an app that loads a .gst and creates a pipeline from it ?
[04:20] <omega_> yeah, examples/xml/runxml
[04:20] <omega_> .c
[04:20] <hadess> whoa, easy
[04:20] <omega_> yeah, that's the idea <g>
[04:21] <hadess> hmm, and to put all that in a thread ?
[04:21] <omega_> well, either save a thread in the xml, or just add it as a child to a thread
[04:21] <hadess> i don't see myself running gst_bin_iterate() in the same process as the gtk gui :)
[04:21] Parapraxis (Spluzz at user-2ivedr6.dialup.mindspring.com) joined #gstreamer.
[04:22] <hadess> fair enough
[04:22] <omega_> we'll eventually add a number of convenience routines, including one that will move all the children from one bin to another
[04:22] <omega_> so you could save your pipeline as a GstBin, load it, and simply convert that toplevel Bin to a Thread
[04:24] <walken> whats the gabber stuff ?
[04:24] <walken> allows you to icq and irc with the same client ?
[04:24] <hadess> walken: gabber.sf.net
[04:24] <hadess> omega_: not too sure of how to deal with that right now...
[04:26] <omega_> I love it.  Bush's 'tech policy guru' hasn't followed *any* of the high-profile privacy or copyright lawsuits
[04:26] <hadess> heh, wanker
[04:27] <omega_> "Actually, I don't know a lot about those cases. So what I've read is only what I've read in the press."
[04:27] <omega_> IT"S YOUR JOB TO KNOW EVERYTHING ABOUT THESE CASES!!!!!
[04:27] <omega_>  /. touts him as more clued that his boss.  Not so sure about that.
[04:28] <omega_> Bush is going to kill this country
[04:30] <walken> cant be much less clued either though
[04:30] <walken> reminds me of an amateur movie "monkey goes to washington"
[04:30] <hadess> lol
[04:30] <hadess> i'm happy not to be an american (once more)
[04:30] <hadess> no offense
[04:31] <omega_> yeah, but you guys have BT <g>
[04:31] <Parapraxis> hey omega_, did you see my q's? :)
[04:31] <omega_> Parapraxis: yeah
[04:31] <omega_> thinking
[04:31] <hadess> omega_: heh, nice one, and we have a queen as well...
[04:31] <Parapraxis> k
[04:31] <omega_> re: second question, the answer is yes, but it's nontrivial
[04:31] <omega_> it's easier to use fakesink and set up a signal handler to get the buffer
[04:32] <Parapraxis> ah, I didn't know there was a way to
[04:32] <omega_> we should probably make an interface to allow the app to construct pseudo elements programatically
[04:33] <omega_> man this guy is incoherent
[04:33] <Parapraxis> can fakesink sink anything?
[04:34] <omega_> yup
[04:35] <Parapraxis> cool
[04:44] <Parapraxis> omega_: how 'bout the 1st q?
[04:45] <omega_> well, haven't had a chance to check out the code, but it seems like a good idea
[04:45] <Parapraxis> ... which one? :)
[04:45] <Parapraxis> using GtkObject?
[04:45] <omega_> you can encapsulate things a lot better, and if you can build a good object structure from it, it could save you a lot of trouble
[04:46] <walken> can you avoid getting tons of icq spam ?
[04:46] <omega_> muhahahhaha! never! spam is all you'll get!!! muhahahaha!
[04:46] <hadess> walken: with gnomeicu you can set some persons to ignore, when it's spam...
[04:48] <hadess> omega_: is it possible to have a gst_init(NULL, NULL) ?
[04:48] <omega_> hadess: I think so, but I wouldn't recommend it if you have a choice
[04:49] <omega_> because you'll regret losing --gst-mask=-1 ability <g>
[04:49] <hadess> fair enough
[04:49] <omega_> eventually, btw, you can put in gst_info_set_mask(0) before gst_init to strip out all info noise even at startup
[04:50] <hadess> oh, cool
[04:51] <omega_> it's set up so that the info/debug in that function itself won't fire if you're setting the mask to zero <g>
[04:55] <hadess> gst_info_set_mask doesn't exist...
[04:57] <omega_> er, not sure the name, it's in gstinfo.h
[04:57] <hadess> gst_info_set_categories ?
[04:58] <omega_> yup
[04:58] Action: omega_ reads about HTS power cables, and wonders what happens when the liquid nitrogen system fails
[04:58] <hadess> dude, this file is a mess =)
[04:58] <omega_> hadess: yeah yeah, quitcher complainin' <g>
[04:59] <hadess> okie, okie
[04:59] <hadess> :P
[04:59] <omega_> afaik incsched's copy is cleaner
[05:01] <omega_> hrm, what worked yesterday isn't working today ;-(
[05:01] <hadess> incsched ?
[05:01] <omega_> yeah, autoplugger
[05:01] <hadess> :/
[05:03] <hadess> damn it, it never finishes loading
[05:04] <omega_> ?
[05:04] <hadess> i'm trying to setup a pipeline that i intend to keep all along the app's lifespan
[05:04] <hadess> and i don't set its state to anything
[05:05] <hadess> and it shits on itself inside some pthread calls
[05:05] <omega_> hmm
[05:05] <hadess> keeps looping there and never finishing loading the app...
[05:05] <omega_> um
[05:07] <hadess> lemme try something...
[05:08] <hadess> disksrc and gnomevfssrc don't handle NULL filenames very well...
[05:08] <hadess> adding that to my todo list...
[05:08] <omega_> oops <g>
[05:09] <hadess> still not working though...
[05:11] <hadess> can i print where it locks up ?
[05:11] <hadess> #0  0xefe159c in sigset () from /lib/libc.so.6
[05:11] <hadess> #1  0xf799c2c in __pthread_wait_for_restart_signal () from /lib/libpthread.so.0
[05:11] <hadess> #2  0xf79bff4 in __pthread_alt_lock () from /lib/libpthread.so.0
[05:11] <hadess> #3  0xf797f74 in pthread_mutex_lock () from /lib/libpthread.so.0
[05:11] <hadess> #4  0xfbf9a9c in gdk_wm_protocols_filter () from /usr/lib/libgdk-1.2.so.0
[05:11] <hadess> #5  0xf87c0f4 in g_get_current_time () from /usr/lib/libglib-1.2.so.0
[05:11] <omega_> yeah, --gst-mask=-1
[05:11] <hadess> #6  0xf87c664 in g_main_run () from /usr/lib/libglib-1.2.so.0
[05:11] <hadess> #7  0xfd175ac in gtk_main () from /usr/lib/libgtk-1.2.so.0
[05:11] <hadess> #8  0xf4ad560 in bonobo_main () from /usr/lib/libbonobo.so.2
[05:11] <hadess> #9  0x10005950 in main (argc=1, argv=0x7ffff8e4) at main.c:38
[05:11] <hadess> </spam>
[05:11] <omega_> um
[05:12] <omega_> start turning things off and see when it goes away
[05:12] <omega_> I don't think it's a gstreamer problem unless it's somehow stomping something else
[05:14] <hadess> do i need to use -gthread and stuff ?
[05:14] <omega_> yeah, but that comes with gst-config
[05:14] <hadess> gdk_threads_enter/leave ?
[05:14] <omega_> um
[05:15] <omega_> I dunno, without seeing the code structure..
[05:16] <hadess> actually, i just have gst_init(), and my app locks up
[05:17] <hadess> when i remove it, it works...
[05:17] <omega_> ummm
[05:17] <hadess> lemme add some more debug to see what's wrong
[05:21] <hadess> messy, messy...
[05:21] <omega_> the only thing it might be doing to cause this is to initialize some mutexes
[05:22] <omega_> first, to eliminate some possibilities.. comment out lines 80-84 of gst.c
[05:22] <hadess> it locks up right after the initialisation (the whole thing)
[05:24] <hadess> no changes
[05:25] <hadess> nope...
[05:25] <omega_> ok, start commenting out some of the init routines <g>
[05:26] <hadess> my init starts from a gtk_idle_add...
[05:26] <omega_> oops
[05:27] <omega_> from gthread docs: Note: g_thread_init() must not be called directly or indirectly as a callback from Glib
[05:27] <omega_> why aren't you calling gst_init() from your main anyway?
[05:27] <hadess> i am
[05:27] <hadess> and i think it works now
[05:28] <hadess> moved the gst_init _after_ gnome_init
[05:28] <omega_> hmm
[05:28] <omega_> better uncomment 80-84 then <g>
[05:29] Smeven (steven at 208.141.180.221) joined #gstreamer.
[05:29] <Smeven> Hey
[05:30] <Smeven> I am trying toplay an avi with gstreamer and it only gives me a black screen.
[05:30] <Smeven> Can anyone help?
[05:30] <omega_> doesn't surprise me
[05:30] <omega_> only a few avi codecs are supported (for various reasons)
[05:30] Parapraxis (Spluzz at user-2ivedr6.dialup.mindspring.com) left irc: Client Exiting
[05:34] <hadess> omega_: with HEAD, do i need to set the state to READY before setting it to PLAYING ?
[05:34] <omega_> no
[05:34] <omega_> it has logic to step through each state as needed
[05:35] <hadess> crashed in pthread_create() this time...
[05:35] <omega_> um
[05:35] <hadess> i constructed my pipeline (a thread), not setting it to anything
[05:36] <omega_> hmmm
[05:36] <hadess> then i set the filename of the what i want, and then set_state to READY, and it crashes...
[05:36] <omega_> who called _create() ?
[05:36] <omega_> oh, right
[05:36] <omega_> ok
[05:36] <Smeven> where can i get divxc32.dll?
[05:36] <omega_> um, then something isn't cooperating with _create()
[05:36] <hadess> gst_element_set_state -> gst_thread_change_state
[05:37] <omega_> Smeven: no clue.  try one of the divx sites, they tend to have .zip's around
[05:37] <omega_> hadess: right
[05:37] <omega_> so, the problem is some of the bonobo code probably is fragging the pthread environment
[05:37] <hadess> probably...
[05:37] <hadess> although threads work fine inside the components
[05:38] <omega_> hmm
[05:42] <hadess> this is the only thing keeping my app from playing :/
[05:43] <omega_> mu
[05:43] Action: omega_ hands hadess a bigger hammer
[05:44] <hadess> thanks, but it doesn't help right now...
[05:45] <omega_> um..... see if you can break on pthread_create, and see who calls it before you do
[05:45] <omega_> if anyone
[05:45] <hadess> lemme try
[05:46] <Smeven> quick question. It says "They want library divxc32.dll" then it fails. I now have this file. Where do I put it?
[05:46] <Smeven> never muind
[05:46] Smeven (steven at 208.141.180.221) left #gstreamer (Client Exiting).
[05:47] <hadess> what a dork
[05:48] <omega_> I'm planning on reworking the gstreamer main page to clearly state that this is not for users
[05:49] <omega_> it never will be, it's a library
[05:49] <hadess> probably a good idea
[05:49] <omega_> when it's ready, we'll tell you, and we'll have some apps (gstplay, rhythmbox, etc.) that you can use
[05:49] <hadess> i can't find the pthread_create...
[05:50] <hadess> break on pthread_create@@GLIBC_2.1 doesn't work
[05:50] <omega_> cool.  go gdb!
[05:50] <hadess> and the only pthread_create<tab> that there is is pthread_create@@GLIBC_2.0 ...
[05:51] <hadess> no pthread_create aat all...
[05:51] <hadess> (gdb) break 'pthread_                  
[05:51] <hadess> pthread_attr_t       pthread_key_t        pthread_once_t
[05:51] <hadess> pthread_cond_t       pthread_mutex_t      pthread_t
[05:51] <hadess> pthread_condattr_t   pthread_mutexattr_t  
[05:51] <hadess> and that's it
[05:52] <omega_> grbm
[05:52] <omega_> s/$/l/
[05:54] <hadess> dammit ! i wrote 4000 lines between friday and today
[05:55] <omega_> have you checked #gnome for any ideas?
[05:55] <hadess> michael is probably sleeping...
[05:55] <hadess> he's the bonobo guy
[05:56] <omega_> where is he?
[05:56] <omega_> uk?
[05:56] <hadess> yep
[05:56] <hadess> and it's 5 am here
[05:56] <omega_> ah, well, so should you <g>
[05:56] <hadess> heh, i know
[06:09] Nick change: aj_uni -> ajmitch
[06:10] <ajmitch> afternoon
[06:15] <hadess> morning =)
[06:16] <ajmitch> about 5:15 am there?
[06:16] <hadess> yup
[06:16] <ajmitch> hmm, i haven't done that for awhile...
[06:17] <hadess> been a while for me as well
[06:17] <hadess> i wish i didn't have stuff to do, i could go to bed now, gstreamer and bonobo don't like each other :/
[06:17] <ajmitch> oh :(
[06:17] <ajmitch> threading issues?
[06:18] <hadess> yep
[06:18] <ajmitch> i remember omega_ saying something about that...
[06:18] <omega_> wtay found that out at one point
[06:18] <omega_> specificially, orbit and threads
[06:19] <ajmitch> yeah
[06:20] <ajmitch> maybe orbit2 will fix that? ;)
[06:20] <omega_> it should
[06:20] <omega_> sowould orbitmt
[06:20] <ajmitch> i think gnome 2.0 will use orbit 2.0
[06:21] <omega_> that's the hope
[06:25] <hadess> did wtay find any fixes for that ?
[06:25] <omega_> dunno