Fwd: Results of the freedesktop summit

Thiago Macieira thiago at kde.org
Wed Apr 17 11:57:14 PDT 2013

On quarta-feira, 17 de abril de 2013 18.58.42, Lennart Poettering wrote:
> Well, this was mostly to get Ryan up to speed. But sure, I'll ask
> everybody else to leave the room next time, when we talk this through
> with Ryan, if that's what you want.

Sorry about the misunderstanding. I was led to believe it was a presentation, 
which would beg the question why it would be suitable for them and not for us. 
I stand corrected.

> Well, for starters, it's a *mailing*  *list*. When you hack and try to
> figure out what you want to do, it's *much* better to do that face to
> face, and that's what we did. The whole reason why Kay and I went down
> to Nuremberg is to have face-to-face discussions, and the emphasis here
> is on "face-to-face"...

I completely understand that.

> If you are pissed that we didn't include you in these face-to-face
> discussions, then maybe you should think about attending too, the next
> time? AFAIK you were invited to the meeting...

I'm not pissed. I was simply trying to understand what was going on. As you 
can see, I had a lot of misunderstandings because nothing has been 
communicated to the D-Bus developers. That's what drove my frustration.

After asking around, talking to Greg and getting these replies, I finally 
understood what is going on.

And yes, I knew the meeting was happening, but as I said it was poorly 

> > I asked some people that question and the answer that satisfied me is
> > "we're experimenting, we quite frankly don't need the bikeshed just yet.
> > But soon.". No offence meant or taken on that, I know how things are once
> > you go public.
> Yeah, and that's pretty much how it is. We don't want the bikshedding for
> now.
> But I guess it's a dilemma. Either the bikeshedding or Thiago
> complaining. Jeez.

Please don't take this the wrong way. I am looking forward to the solutions 
you guys implement. I also understand the bikeshedding that will happen when 
you finally present the solution, so it's better to stay focused with a small 
group and meet face-to-face.

I wish I could also participate, but I know that I don't have the time, so I 
won't ask for it.

But also understand that you guys are not (yet) tapping on the pool of 
knowledge on this mailing list. Just don't forget that. For example, I did set 
Greg on a momentary bind by mentioning three-connection delivery ordering, a 
use-case he had not thought of. but that fortunately the new solution does not 

I still think you guys could have communicated better with us -- twice this 
topic has come up and it's been because other people elsewhere, on other lists 
and forums, have brought it up. A lot could have been avoided by a proactive 
email here or there.

Yes, I was complaining. So thank you for addressing my concerns. Hack on and 
know we're here. Until I hear otherwise, I'll keep assuming it's still at 
experimentation stage and better left to the people who have the time to work 
on it.

Thiago Macieira - thiago (AT) macieira.info - thiago (AT) kde.org
   Software Architect - Intel Open Source Technology Center
      PGP/GPG: 0x6EF45358; fingerprint:
      E067 918B B660 DBD1 105C  966C 33F5 F005 6EF4 5358
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