Thoughts about decoration information in the xdg_shell

Jasper St. Pierre jstpierre at
Sun Nov 17 23:58:41 PST 2013

So, let me be clear:

I'm not fundamentally opposed to any of this. Personally, I feel that
decorations aren't something that we need server-side support for to
establish consistency between apps, and that there's a myriad of other
cross-app consistency bugs and issues that we should solve first (in both
look and feel), but if I was forced to implement SSD support in GTK+ I'd
cut my losses and call it a day. It's just some code.

But, both Rafael Antognolli and I already have our plates full with a lot
of other Wayland work, and neither of us care about server-side decorations
*that* much, so it's like the 500th item on the TODO list. Arguing over the
mailing list and IRC aren't going to be enough to convince either of us to
add it to the spec on our own time.

If the KDE team feels extremely strongly about server-side decorations, I'd
like to see that passion channeled into actually building things. Write an
extension that does what you want. Patch weston/westoy and KWin/Qt to
implement all of this. Upload a cool YouTube video showing you switching
decorations at runtime. Any or all of those things are going to influence
me infinitely more than simply yelling at me for not supporting KWin's use

On Mon, Nov 18, 2013 at 2:47 AM, Thiago Macieira
<thiago.macieira at>wrote:

> On segunda-feira, 18 de novembro de 2013 08:20:37, Martin Gräßlin wrote:
> > I'm afraid that exactly that will happen then and I think it's the
> shell's
> > responsibility to enforce the style. For things like Plasma Active or
> other
> > tiling setups we need to have the client without decorations. Our users
> > will not consider it as an application bug, it's a bug in our system. I
> > might be overly skeptical here, but my experience unfortunately is, that
> > apps and toolkits (exception Qt) do not try to integrate with the
> > environment.
> Understood, but discussion on IRC shows that other toolkits do not want to
> add
> the feature and that Kristian does not want to make it mandatory either.
> You're the losing voice here, Martin.
> Do the best you can for kwin and Qt will help you. If other applications
> look
> out of place, we'll have to do our best to get users to report the issues
> as
> bugs.
> If you're right about your decision, other toolkits will eventually come
> around and implement similar functionality. If you're wrong, then they will
> keep doing what they're doing.
> Also note that there's another way of solving the problem: clients
> continue to
> decorate by themselves, but the clients somehow find the information
> describing
> what they should decorate with. That means you get the consistency *and*
> the
> performance of client-side decorations. I believe the forum for that
> discussion is the xdg mailing list.
> --
> Thiago Macieira - thiago.macieira (AT)
>   Software Architect - Intel Open Source Technology Center
> _______________________________________________
> wayland-devel mailing list
> wayland-devel at

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